Sept. 3, 2001, 4:50 a.m. (Message 27167)
Substitute teacher here, for the next two weeks, and presenting dances from the Camp Ramblewood evening programs... 1) Invercauld's Reel, end of bar 16. Bars 9-16. 2C and 1C rights and left (1C are in second place on opp. sides to start) Bars 17-24. Set to and turn corners Would M1 complete the polite turn at the end of R&L, seeing as how he should end facing his first corner? Would he, rather, dance straight into this position? Bk. 11 and TACNotes don't say anything about *not* completing the polite turn. 2) Machine without Horses (Bk.12) Bars 17-24. 1C followed by 2C dance down between 3C, cast up around them, dance up to top and cast off into 2d place, while 2C dance up to the top. TACNotes states that the 2C dance straight into top position, but I've sometimes seen folks looping around into place; in essence, following the 1C as they cast, but only casting around top place to end there. I tried it and can understand why folks might like it as an entry into the R&L which follow, but I wouldn't teach it unless it were an acceptable option. Thanks for your advice. Pat Charlottesville, Virginia
Sept. 3, 2001, 5:34 a.m. (Message 27168, in reply to message 27167)
Invercauld's Reel: M1 gives left hands to finish rights & lefts and dances straight in to face first corner - no polite turn. These days they call it "linking "one formation to another!!!!! Ynys Wilson (NZ)
Sept. 3, 2001, 10:05 a.m. (Message 27171, in reply to message 27167)
Patricia Ruggiero <xxxxxxxxx@xxxxxxxxx.xxx> writes: > 1) Invercauld's Reel, end of bar 16. [...] > Would M1 complete the polite turn at the end of R&L, seeing as how he should > end facing his first corner? I'd say no polite turn. If you leave out the polite turn you're practically there, but if you do the polite turn you have to pivot around nearly one and a half times to finish facing your corner. (Note that there are lots of people who would enjoy this particularly.) > 2) Machine without Horses (Bk.12) > > TACNotes states that the 2C dance straight into top position, but I've > sometimes seen folks looping around into place; in essence, following the 1C > as they cast, but only casting around top place to end there. I tried it > and can understand why folks might like it as an entry into the R&L which > follow, but I wouldn't teach it unless it were an acceptable option. I usually teach the no-cast version even though the entry into the R&L is a bit more difficult, because it looks `cleaner'. It depends on how much time there is at the end of the `figure of eight', and whether your dancers manage to do the cast without appearing rushed, but I don't think there's anything to be said specifically against the cast version. Anselm -- Anselm Lingnau .......................................... xxxxxx@xxxxxxxxxx.xxx It is not enough to have knowledge, one must also apply it. It is not enough to have wishes, one must also accomplish. -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
Sept. 3, 2001, 7:01 p.m. (Message 27180, in reply to message 27167)
There is no polite turn for 1st man before facing corner. He does dance indirectly to his first corner Bob Mc Murtry
Sept. 4, 2001, 2:52 a.m. (Message 27182, in reply to message 27180)
Many thanks to those who responded so quickly (class is tomorrow - Tuesday - night). I esp. appreciated Richard Goss' criteria for judging when to execute the polite turn in *any* dance. As for Machine w/o Horses: while I might, as a dancer, choose to cast (as a 2C) into top position, I will not teach that version tomorrow night. I may be back next week with a question or two.... Thanks again! Pat
Sept. 3, 2001, 5:59 p.m. (Message 27181, in reply to message 27167)
INVERCAULD & MACHINE 3 September 2001 [xxxxxxx.x.xxxx@xxx.xxx] [Seems that Anselm and I are on the same track] INVERCAULD'S REEL - S3x32 [XI10] 15-16: Polite turn or not? The "polite turn" is a creation of the RSCDS, and as such is not a part of any specific choreog- raphy. It is a function of dancing, not a dance. Unfortunately, too many teachers confuse the teaching of dancing with the teaching of a specific dance. This results in less experienced dancers often being confused when they learn a dancing motif only within the context of a dance and not the motif itself. The "polite turn" is a terminal activity, in that it is always appropriate at the end of a repetition of a dance. It is also convenient when the dancer being turned into place is either going to be "heels down" on the next bar, or, if not, needs to be turned in such a way as to be ready for the next figure. In keeping with the above, the answer is yes [2m] and no [1m]. As 1m is changing places, left hand, with 2w on bars 15-16w, she is already placing him into position for the set and turn figure upcoming. To use a polite turn here would cause him to have to turn 1.5x to face cnr1, and probably be late for the next figure. However 2m, needs to be cnr1 and facing into the set, so the polite turn is necessary for him to be ready to face 1w. I am not against TAC notes as such, but teachers and dancers should not rely on them as gospel. Since the Society, our primary source, of- ten makes mistakes, one should use care in reading a secondary source. ***** MACHINE WITHOUT HORSES - J3x32 [XII12] 23-24: 2s cast or not? There is no ambiguity in the RSCDS notes of 1938 as the words and their accompanying figure say 2s "dance to the top." As an RSCDS teacher, this is how I have always taught it. On the other hand, for reasons previously stated, I would never correct 2s who chose to case, and were able to do so without arriving late for the next [rights and lefts] figure. In fact this is the way, I prefer to dance Machine myself. At the time of publication, "Machine..." had no living tradition as being danced, so the Society had to rely on Rutherford, 1772 for its source of information. Rutherford does not specify how the 2s get to the top. Often, when the seams are a bit ragged in our dances, it is an indica- tion that the Society has misinterpreted the original instructions. My reading of R1772 indi- cates that this may well have happened in this case. ***** Goss