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Caberfei Jan. 24, 2002, 10:47 p.m. (Message 29265)
Can anyone tell me the history behind the dance other then what is in Book #1, I am mostly interested in the name and how the dance came by it. Thanks Ralph Stoddard DC USA
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res009k3 Jan. 25, 2002, 12:26 a.m. (Message 29268, in reply to message 29265)
I don't remember if this site has an archival system for retrieving old postings, but sometime in the past I already answered your question re CC. The points are: 1. In figure dancing there a number of formations: longways, square, round the room, etc. 2. Longways can be while round, minor, improper, etc. 4. As a longways dance, CC is a duple minor, in a set "for many as will", imporper (1s crossed over to begin). 5. As "round the room dance", CC is "two facing two" (Ecossaise)as opposed to a "Swedish progression" (3-3 as in DWS), or "union/mezcolanze progression" (4-4 as in Tempete). 6. Other names for a duple minor improper (Ecossaise) in a circle are "Sicilian" or "Circassian [*1]" circles. 7. Of the many "Circassian Circles" the RSCDS version is one example of a generic dance type having its name applied to a specific example. [*2 badly choreographed I might add]. 8. The same figures as our CC are also done in square for- mation in quadrilles. Here, where what the RSCDS would call dances, are called figures, usually 5 or 6. The first figure, often given a French generic name such as poule, or the name of the opening tune of a named medley [*3]. ----- *1: The Turks, invading Christian lands often kidnapped the children, raising them as muslems to serve in janissary armies. Having no families, and forbidden to marry until retirement these, Circassians, tended to be loyal to the Sultan. After retirement they were al- lowed to marry and settle down, and were often given high positions within the Turkish civil service. Their name comes from those of a collection of Caucasian tribes in the former USSR. At the time of quadrilles, many had military names, lancers, hussars (also from Eastern Europe) for example, attached to them, and / or their figures. *2: [previously posted] The 32 bar tune, CC, consists of two 8 bar strains AABB. While I have found other sources of our dance using the same figures, the sequence of the figures is more appropriate to the music than the RSCDS choreography. SCD: RL - S2&T - LChn - Puset Other: RL - LChn - S2&T - Puset The reasons why I feel our version is not the best are 1. While the music is AABB, the dance is ABAB with A using a skip change of step and B using a pas de basque. 2. If we align the steps with the music we have more natural transitions ... RL-LChain (no polite turns & end by joining hands) S2T-Puset (hands already joined for pousette). *3: For example, in the quadrille, "Trial by Jury" all six figures (dances) are named after and use tunes from that operetta by G&S. In the Caledonians, the tunes are familiar tunes associated with Caledonia. All of my early editions of SCD Book 1 have a note saying that, "this dance is the same as the first figure of Quadrille" [Note: lack of article and uppercase "Q"]. Asides: 1. I am still looking for and have yet to discover the "real" name of the tune now called "Circassian Circle". This is an ongoing historical problem as tunes migrated easily. For example, I have heard that the worlds best known tune is that to which we sing "Auld Lang Syne" and so it is by that name that we know it. In fact, there is a tune "Hey Tuttee Tattie" to which Alan Ramsey set his poem, "Auld Lang Syne". All Burns did was paraphrase Ramsey's poem for his own more popular one and set it to the same music. If anyone can find Circassian Circle's tune with another name, I would appreciate the info. 2. In bridging to another strand in this site, regarding the figure ladies' chain, I would like to put some historical perspective on the older "8" vs modern RSCDS "Z" version. [Citing SCD Book I, inaccurately dated 1924, probably around 1950 as it advertizes SCD Books 1-14 and has a price of 3/ [15p] printed on the cover, overprinted with 3/6 [17.5p] {SCD Book 11 was originally 2/6 [12.5p]. "[bars] 17-20 Ladies' chain. That is, women give right hands to one another, cross over and turn the opposite man round by the left hand. Men dance into partner's place to recieve and turn opposite woman. 21-24 The same again. This time the woman turn their own partners." In other words, my illustration in a previous post is unambiguously describe here in words: 1-2. Men dance into partner's place (not beyond it) as women dance into the place vacated by the men (not each other). 3-4. Men by giving women a half turn place them in each other's original places and return to their own (path is "8" not "Z") [there is no diagram shown]. In my later edition of SCD Book I [also inaccurately dated 1924, probably after 1970, no SCD adverts or printed price (stamped 25p)], the page is an offset reproduction of the earlier without any changes. If the "Duncan" version existed, prior to the change from l/s/d currency to decimal, I have yet to see any evidence of it. While the "Note. --" cited above equates this [SCD] figure to one done in the quadrilles, it would have been impossible for the head couples to do the "Z" ladies' chain in a square formation with the sides blocking the man's path. Prior to WYJTD[Green] their was no handbook for SCD beyond descriptions given in the Books. For example in the original edition, foreward are described, sets, steps [skip change, pas de basque, common & Highland Schottische - no strathspey], and progressions [pousette and Allemande], and reeling [right shoulder only, as the left shoulder or mirror reels had not been discovered yet]. In 1923, the Strathspey step for longways country dances had not been invented yet and our present step was not that used in the Highland foursome reel. There is the caveat below the table of contents that verifies that the references given below our dances are only the oldest known form, not necessarily the choreography published by the [R]SCDS. If one wanted to more accurately date my oldest Book 1, this could be done by checking the address for Paterson's Publications in London, Sydney, Toronto, Wellington, & New York or J Michael Diacks copyright for his editions of: Welsh Cradel Song, by H. S. Roberton [#1859 R Goss [xxxxxxx.x.xxxx@xxx.xxx] -
RON TAYLOR Jan. 25, 2002, 8:30 a.m. (Message 29276, in reply to message 29268)
Does anyone really read this ! Ron
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Alan Paterson Jan. 25, 2002, 11:02 a.m. (Message 29280, in reply to message 29276)
RON TAYLOR wrote: > > Does anyone really read this ! <snip massive quotation of Richard Goss's message> No. I don't actually. I WOULD be interested, since Richard has a lot of interesting things to say, but, as all of his (and only his) messages arrive in my PC in an almost unreadable format, I delete them unread. Alan
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Martin.Sheffield Jan. 25, 2002, 9:52 a.m. (Message 29281, in reply to message 29276)
At 08:30 25/01/02, you wrote: >Does anyone really read this ! Yes. Was it really necessary to quote the original message in extenso ? Martin in Grenoble, France http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/index.htm
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Ian McHaffie Jan. 25, 2002, 1:26 p.m. (Message 29287, in reply to message 29276)
Yes, Ron, there are some who do. And when I find a message from Strathspey or elsewhere that I don¹t want to read, I touch single key (that I have programmed) that sends the message to the trash faster than even the thought of complaining. Ian
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SallenNic Jan. 25, 2002, 2:21 p.m. (Message 29289, in reply to message 29265)
In a message dated 25/1/02 10:03:14 am, xxxxx@xxxxxxx.xx writes: >I WOULD be interested, since Richard has a lot of >interesting things to say, but, as all of his (and only his) messages >arrive in my PC in an almost unreadable format, I delete them unread. I never have any trouble reading Richard's postings (and find them most illuminating): is this possibly because I use a Mac? Nicolas B., Lanark, Scotland.