strathspey Archive: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

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Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55463 · Chris Ronald · 26 Mar 2009 01:37:28 · Top

Peter asked "how do people feel about SCD bands using "non-traditional"
instruments?"

Well, Peter, I would assume people are pretty content with non-traditional
instruments, given that most - maybe all - bands featured on RSCDS
recordings use mainly non-traditional instruments.

Sorry, couldn't resist that!

Chris, New York.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55465 · Steve Wyrick · 26 Mar 2009 02:23:47 · Top

As a fiddler, I appreciate that reminder, Chris!
I often play in a trio consisting of fiddle, piano and recorder (Hood, Wink
& Swagger, with Ron Wallace and Gary Thomas). I suspect that recorder would
not have been featured in the bands of the early 1800s but I think that
wooden flute would have and this gives a similar sound. We're currently
mulling adding a cello to add some bottom end but it's a nice sound, and
quite versatile, in my opinion.
Anselm, Andy Imbrie used a Cajon player in his band a couple years ago at
our Asilomar ball. I liked the sound but reaction to their arrangements was
quite mixed. When his band was back last Fall they used the same
percussionist but he stuck to a trap set instead which I suppose was more
"traditional" but didn't give as wide a range of sounds, and wasn't as
appealing to me. -Steve

On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 5:37 PM, Chris Ronald <cjr878@gmail.com> wrote:

> Peter asked "how do people feel about SCD bands using "non-traditional"
> instruments?"
>
> Well, Peter, I would assume people are pretty content with non-traditional
> instruments, given that most - maybe all - bands featured on RSCDS
> recordings use mainly non-traditional instruments.
>
> Sorry, couldn't resist that!
>
> Chris, New York.
>
>

--
Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
Sent from: San Francisco CA United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55470 · Monica Pollard · 26 Mar 2009 05:13:59 · Top

Steve Wyrick <sjwyrick@gmail.com> wrote:
>.... Andy Imbrie used a Cajon player in his band a couple years ago at
> our Asilomar ball. ....  When his band was back last Fall they used the same
> percussionist but he stuck to a trap set instead which I suppose was more
> "traditional" but didn't give as wide a range of sounds, and wasn't as
> appealing to me.

Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
playing, and dancing, for that matter.

guess we all have our own pet peeves.

Monica
--
"If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a
horrible warning."
Catherine Aird

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55474 · Martin Campoveja · 26 Mar 2009 09:59:53 · Top

2009/3/26 Monica Pollard wrote :
>
> Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> Scottish country dance music - a drum set.

Hear, hear.

The CDs I never use are the ones with monotonous boom, boom, or tch, tch,
throughout. Although the CD label indicates a person's name, I think they
may as well have used a machine.
Leave that to the under-twenties who would not know a melody if they heard
one.
So, Anselm, be gentle if you start playing your wooden box in public. I
imagine most people would rather hear your fingers on the keyboard.

A few years ago, an accoreonist coming to play for us suggested bringing a
drummer. No thank you ! I was not going to spend any of my small stock of
euros on that.

During the holiday I organized last summer, we had some very talented
people, and the regular musicians were joined by flautist, guitarrist,
pianist (not to mention clever blowing on half empty wine-bottles). That
made us dance -- and listen. Variety is the spice of life.

Martin

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55478 · Steve Wyrick · 26 Mar 2009 15:45:09 · Top

On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
> the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
> playing, and dancing, for that matter.
>
>
Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
--
Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55479 · SMiskoe · 26 Mar 2009 15:50:54 · Top

When I was taking the musicians' course at St Andrews 3 years ago I was told
that the basic instrumentation for a SCD band was first accordion, 2nd
accordion and snare drum with high hat cymbal. After that, depending on your
budget, you could add fiddles, keyboard, whatever.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55480 · Mike Mudrey · 26 Mar 2009 16:07:44 · Top

At 09:50 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>When I was taking the musicians' course at St Andrews 3 years ago I was told
>that the basic instrumentation for a SCD band was first accordion, 2nd
>accordion and snare drum with high hat cymbal. After that,
>depending on your
>budget, you could add fiddles, keyboard, whatever.
>Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Sylvia, lets see what our collective group considers to be a
"traditional" suite of instruments.

Howe and others 19th century music defines a traditional group of
keyboard, string(s) and flute. This is generally maintained in ECD
today. That suite of instruments covers the audio spectrum maintains
melody, rhythm and harmony.

mm

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55481 · Steve Wyrick · 26 Mar 2009 16:16:57 · Top

On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 8:07 AM, Michael Mudrey <mgmudrey@mhtc.net> wrote:

> At 09:50 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>
>> When I was taking the musicians' course at St Andrews 3 years ago I was
>> told
>> that the basic instrumentation for a SCD band was first accordion, 2nd
>> accordion and snare drum with high hat cymbal. After that, depending on
>> your
>> budget, you could add fiddles, keyboard, whatever.
>> Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA
>>
>
>
> Sylvia, lets see what our collective group considers to be a "traditional"
> suite of instruments.
>
> Howe and others 19th century music defines a traditional group of keyboard,
> string(s) and flute. This is generally maintained in ECD today. That
> suite of instruments covers the audio spectrum maintains melody, rhythm and
> harmony.
>
> mm
>
>
I have several Scottish collections from the 1790s to early 1800s that are
scored for fiddle, keyboard (harpsichord earlier, pianoforte later) and
cello.

--
Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55482 · Anselm Lingnau · 26 Mar 2009 16:18:40 · Top

SMiskoe@aol.com wrote:

> When I was taking the musicians' course at St Andrews 3 years ago I was
> told that the basic instrumentation for a SCD band was first accordion, 2nd
> accordion and snare drum with high hat cymbal.

That would be »a SCD band after about 1830«. The mainstays of traditional
Scottish dance music like Niel Gow, Robert Mackintosh, and William Marshall
never saw an accordion. Strangely enough, they still managed to form bands
and make a living that way.

The nice thing about accordions from a dance musician's point of view is that
(in order of priority) (a) they are LOUD, (b) you get to play a melody and
rhythmic accompaniment at the same time, and (c) the package is still
man-portable. There are fringe benefits of accordions including not requiring
constant tuning the way a fiddle does, not giving the player bruises on the
chin and calluses on the fingers, and being playable while comfortably
seated. Family and neighbours will appreciate the fact that the learning
experience for an aspiring accordionist completely omits the first six months
during which the only sounds a new fiddler is able to produce resemble those
of small animals being tortured.

No wonder the accordion caught on quickly once it had been invented, and who
cares if they don't sound quite like fiddles? :^)

Anselm
(occasional accordion player)
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany ..................... anselm@strathspey.org
Zealots, whatever their cause, invariably lack a sense of humor. They can't
reply in kind to jokes. They're as unhappy on the territory of humor as a
mounted knight on a skating rink. -- Paul Graham, »What You Can't Say«

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55487 · Pia Walker · 26 Mar 2009 17:28:11 · Top

The people you mentioned probalby also played in houses that had keyboards
of some kind in situ - as these are the absolute devils to move when you are
travelling by horse and cart or on foot.

I don't know how old accordions are - but have always thought of them as an
old instrument. If anyone is interested, there's an Antique Accordion Museum
outside Inverness at Bogbain Farm and Heritage centre with about 60
accordions from ages spanning 1840-1960 on display.

Pia

-----Original Message-----
From: Anselm Lingnau [mailto:anselm@strathspey.org]
Sent: 26 March 2009 15:19
To: strathspey@strathspey.org
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

That would be »a SCD band after about 1830«. The mainstays of traditional
Scottish dance music like Niel Gow, Robert Mackintosh, and William Marshall
never saw an accordion. Strangely enough, they still managed to form bands
and make a living that way.

The nice thing about accordions from a dance musician's point of view is
that
(in order of priority) (a) they are LOUD, (b) you get to play a melody and
rhythmic accompaniment at the same time, and (c) the package is still
man-portable. There are fringe benefits of accordions including not
requiring
constant tuning the way a fiddle does, not giving the player bruises on the
chin and calluses on the fingers, and being playable while comfortably
seated. Family and neighbours will appreciate the fact that the learning
experience for an aspiring accordionist completely omits the first six
months
during which the only sounds a new fiddler is able to produce resemble those
of small animals being tortured.

No wonder the accordion caught on quickly once it had been invented, and who
cares if they don't sound quite like fiddles? :^)

Anselm
(occasional accordion player)
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany .....................
anselm@strathspey.org
Zealots, whatever their cause, invariably lack a sense of humor. They can't
reply in kind to jokes. They're as unhappy on the territory of humor as a
mounted knight on a skating rink. -- Paul Graham, »What You Can't
Say«

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55489 · sophie.rickebusch · 26 Mar 2009 17:54:11 · Top

Pia wrote:

>The people you mentioned probalby also played in houses that had
keyboards
>of some kind in situ - as these are the absolute devils to move when
you are
>travelling by horse and cart or on foot.

Rest assured that it is not much easier to move a piano by lorry! To
quote my removal men while they were having a well-deserved cuppa after
getting my piano up the stairs:
"Next time you move, by all means use this company again, but please
ask for our colleagues!"

;-)
Sophie
[currently Edinburgh (UK) - formerly Grenoble (FR), Zurich (CH), Vevey
(CH)...]

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55491 · Anselm Lingnau · 26 Mar 2009 18:45:04 · Top

Pia wrote:

> The people you mentioned probalby also played in houses that had keyboards
> of some kind in situ - as these are the absolute devils to move when you
> are travelling by horse and cart or on foot.

These, though, would have been suitable only for small dance parties -- the
keyboard instruments of the time were not really loud. Volume was one of the
key advantages of the piano, which was also invented only during the second
half of the 18th century; in point of fact it was actually *possible* to play
it both softly, loudly, and in between, which is why it was called
the »pianoforte«, from the musical terms for »soft« and »loud«. Its
precursor, the harpsichord, being an instrument whose strings are plucked
with quills rather than struck with hammers, does not do dynamics at all well
and wasn't a very loud instrument to begin with, with other parlour-type
keyboard instruments like the clavichord and spinet even softer -- they would
be much more suitable for a ladies' drawing room than a crowded ballroom.
Harpsichords are also absolute bears to maintain, whereas with a modern piano
it is usually all right to have the tuner come by once a year or so.

> I don't know how old accordions are - but have always thought of them as an
> old instrument. If anyone is interested, there's an Antique Accordion
> Museum outside Inverness at Bogbain Farm and Heritage centre with about 60
> accordions from ages spanning 1840-1960 on display.

The accordion as we know it was invented in a gradual process beginning in the
1820s or so. The first instrument actually called an »accordion«, in fact,
could do exactly that and nothing else -- you played chords with your left
hand, and as the thing did not have anything on its other end (except for a
cover, one presumes) you would have your right hand free to hang on to a
pint. Of course the innovation was that the instrument actually played a
*chord* at the touch of one left-hand button; the idea of having single notes
and a bellows was somewhat older. It still took a few decades for anything
resembling the modern instrument to appear, by which time the country dance
in Scotland was mostly a thing of the past.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany ..................... anselm@strathspey.org
Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of
us who do. -- Isaac Asimov

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55492 · SMiskoe · 26 Mar 2009 18:50:12 · Top


In a message dated 3/26/2009 12:28:56 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
pia@intamail.com writes:

ages spanning 1840-1960 on display.

That's about the time accordions were developed. Think about what Goe and
Marshall might have written if they had been invented while these 2 were alive.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55494 · Angela Bulteel · 26 Mar 2009 18:57:43 · Top

Anselm, I just love all your little anecdotes at the end of your
correspondence, I think I should start a note book and write them all down,
they are brilliant and make me smile every time I read them. Thankyou for
brightening my days. Angela
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anselm Lingnau" <anselm@strathspey.org>
To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Pia wrote:

> The people you mentioned probalby also played in houses that had keyboards
> of some kind in situ - as these are the absolute devils to move when you
> are travelling by horse and cart or on foot.

These, though, would have been suitable only for small dance parties -- the
keyboard instruments of the time were not really loud. Volume was one of the
key advantages of the piano, which was also invented only during the second
half of the 18th century; in point of fact it was actually *possible* to
play
it both softly, loudly, and in between, which is why it was called
the »pianoforte«, from the musical terms for »soft« and »loud«. Its
precursor, the harpsichord, being an instrument whose strings are plucked
with quills rather than struck with hammers, does not do dynamics at all
well
and wasn't a very loud instrument to begin with, with other parlour-type
keyboard instruments like the clavichord and spinet even softer -- they
would
be much more suitable for a ladies' drawing room than a crowded ballroom.
Harpsichords are also absolute bears to maintain, whereas with a modern
piano
it is usually all right to have the tuner come by once a year or so.

> I don't know how old accordions are - but have always thought of them as
> an
> old instrument. If anyone is interested, there's an Antique Accordion
> Museum outside Inverness at Bogbain Farm and Heritage centre with about 60
> accordions from ages spanning 1840-1960 on display.

The accordion as we know it was invented in a gradual process beginning in
the
1820s or so. The first instrument actually called an »accordion«, in fact,
could do exactly that and nothing else -- you played chords with your left
hand, and as the thing did not have anything on its other end (except for a
cover, one presumes) you would have your right hand free to hang on to a
pint. Of course the innovation was that the instrument actually played a
*chord* at the touch of one left-hand button; the idea of having single
notes
and a bellows was somewhat older. It still took a few decades for anything
resembling the modern instrument to appear, by which time the country dance
in Scotland was mostly a thing of the past.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany .....................
anselm@strathspey.org
Those people who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those
of
us who do. -- Isaac
Asimov

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Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55496 · SMiskoe · 26 Mar 2009 19:10:19 · Top

This is an example of how music changes. The setting is the contra dance
world, not the RSCDS world, but I think it is a universal happening.
Rodney Miller is an astounding fiddler, he plays for dancing. At some point
he began to be more inventive, he said it all started when after the
umpteenth time of playing a particular tune he wondered what else he could with it.
He was in great demand as a player, teach at dance camps, even was invited
to perform at the Lerwick Shetland Festival. He brought out a new recording
that was really out of the box with rhythms and instrumentation. For some
time he was considered a pariah to tradition and didn't get as much work. But,
time passed, other musicians began imitating Rodney and he became acceptable
again. He just went too far outside the box the first time. He has
influenced how contra music is played, the sort of tunes used, and is busier than
ever.
When I first began playing SCD I was told that only Scots, born in Scotland,
could properly play the music. Fortunately for all the American dancers and
musicians this idea proved incorrect.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55498 · Etienne Ozorak · 26 Mar 2009 19:37:01 · Top

Sylvia,

I have some archival CBC-TV footage of the Don Messer show (mid to
late 1960s). On all his recordings, he would play one tune over and
over for 3 minutes. No improvisation. No change. He also did this
on TV....about 95% of the time (there is some footage of him on
youtube). The other 5% of the time they would do medleys, but that
was rarely done back then. Canadian fiddler Graham Townshend used
the same formula until about the mid-seventies after which all his
recorded tracks were medleys.

I also remember a TV show around 1972 out of maritime Canada (with
Scottish Singer Alasdair Gillies and accordionist John Carmichael)
and most of what the fiddle group on the show played were
medleys. Seems like a change was made back then that is broader than
any niche market.

Etienne Ozorak, Meadville PA USA

At 02:10 PM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>This is an example of how music changes. The setting is the contra dance
>world, not the RSCDS world, but I think it is a universal happening.
>Rodney Miller is an astounding fiddler, he plays for dancing. At some point
>he began to be more inventive, he said it all started when after the
>umpteenth time of playing a particular tune he wondered what else he
>could with it.
>He was in great demand as a player, teach at dance camps, even was invited
>to perform at the Lerwick Shetland Festival. He brought out a new recording
>that was really out of the box with rhythms and instrumentation. For some
>time he was considered a pariah to tradition and didn't get as much
>work. But,
>time passed, other musicians began imitating Rodney and he became acceptable
>again. He just went too far outside the box the first time. He has
>influenced how contra music is played, the sort of tunes used, and
>is busier than
>ever.
>When I first began playing SCD I was told that only Scots, born in Scotland,
>could properly play the music. Fortunately for all the American dancers and
>musicians this idea proved incorrect.
>Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55500 · Martin Campoveja · 26 Mar 2009 19:52:02 · Top

Dear Sylvia,
How brave of you to continue playing for SCD (and recording for us on the
European side) -- after being told at St Andrews that nothing but accordeon
and percussion was correct for SCD. How dull you band's music would havbe
been, if you had listenend then! The variety of instruments you use is a
delight.

And then :

> I was told that only Scots, born in Scotland,
> could properly play the music.

Some people are capable of such rubbish. I'm surprised they even consider
having Sasanachs or (gasp) Americans on the dance floor.

Martin

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55505 · Pia Walker · 26 Mar 2009 20:03:42 · Top

Try Danes teaching in Scotland :>)

Things are a-changing - Can I just point out that the teachers for the
International Branch Weekend in October hails from France, the USA, and
below the border.

and we have a musician coming from Europe - one from below the border - and
2 from Scotland

Pia

Some people are capable of such rubbish. I'm surprised they even consider
having Sasanachs or (gasp) Americans on the dance floor.

Martin

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55506 · SMiskoe · 26 Mar 2009 20:06:22 · Top

I wasn't told that only accordion/percussion were correct. I was told that
they were the ideal.
The bravery comes from 40 years ago when I was trying to introduce live
music into Boston and nobody believed Americans could play it. SCD became
popular in the first place because there were so many ex-patriot Scots who wanted
to continue dancing.
Cheers,
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55483 · Etienne Ozorak · 26 Mar 2009 16:30:53 · Top

Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.

Etienne

At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
> >
> >
>Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
>--
>Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55484 · Steve Wyrick · 26 Mar 2009 16:47:34 · Top

Agreed. I also know dancers who don't like dancing to fiddles because they
feel they don't give a clear enough beat. Personally I think there's room
for it all. I wish we had some good accordion bands out here, in addition
to all the good fiddle bands! -Steve

On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 8:30 AM, Etienne Ozorak <etozorak@allegheny.edu>wrote:

> Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.
>
> Etienne
>
>
>
> At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
>> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
>> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
>> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
>> >
>> >
>> Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
>> --
>> Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
>>
>
>

--
Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55485 · SMiskoe · 26 Mar 2009 16:47:29 · Top

A Scottish fiddler once said to me that tradition is what you did 15 years
ago.

If we look at music played in the 18th century, when Playford's books were
coming up to Scotland, you had no accordions, no pianos, probably no snare
drums nor silver flutes. Jimmy Shand set the standard in the 30's through the
60's. Alasdair Fraser has had a huge influence on fiddling, especially here
in the US. I sometimes wonder if Alasdair had played accordion would there be
lots of wannabe accordionists instead of fiddlers.
People dance to what is available, musicians become inventive in order to
combat boredom. Sometimes the inventions work and sometimes they don't. The
bombard has crept into some contra bands via a very good, very inventive flute
player. Will that be the next SCD experiment?
Sylvia Miskoe, concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55490 · Chris Ronald · 26 Mar 2009 18:18:21 · Top

Sylvia wrote:

>
> "If we look at music played in the 18th century, when Playford's books were
> coming up to Scotland, you had no accordions, no pianos, probably no snare
> drums nor silver flutes. Jimmy Shand set the standard in the 30's through
> the
> 60's. Alasdair Fraser has had a huge influence on fiddling, especially
> here
> in the US."

Yes, we're very lucky in the US, thanks to Alasdair, and Barbara McOwen and
others who have inspired such wonderful fiddle music here. I know tastes
differ a lot, but as far as I'm concerned nothing beats a fiddle for dancing
strathspeys to.

Chris, New York.

> I sometimes wonder if Alasdair had played accordion would there be
> lots of wannabe accordionists instead of fiddlers.
> People dance to what is available, musicians become inventive in order to
> combat boredom. Sometimes the inventions work and sometimes they don't.
> The
> bombard has crept into some contra bands via a very good, very inventive
> flute
> player. Will that be the next SCD experiment?
> Sylvia Miskoe, concord, NH USA
>
>

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55486 · Etienne Ozorak · 26 Mar 2009 17:23:51 · Top

I'm in the odd situation of being in an area where there are about 8
really good musicians to work with -- but our closest dance groups
are all two hours drive away. One band -- no dancers!

Etienne

At 11:47 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>Agreed. I also know dancers who don't like dancing to fiddles because they
>feel they don't give a clear enough beat. Personally I think there's room
>for it all. I wish we had some good accordion bands out here, in addition
>to all the good fiddle bands! -Steve
>
>On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 8:30 AM, Etienne Ozorak <etozorak@allegheny.edu>wrote:
>
> > Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.
> >
> > Etienne
> >
> >
> >
> > At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
> >
> >> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> >> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
> >> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
> >> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
> >> --
> >> Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>--
>Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
>Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55521 · mlamontbrown · 27 Mar 2009 11:46:57 · Top

I think the nearest band that that plays for us is about 2 hours drive away, and most
of them have at least a five hours drive - strange thing is, most of them drive back
after the dance!

Malcolm

Malcolm L Brown
York (UK)

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Etienne Ozorak [mailto:etozorak@allegheny.edu]
> Sent: 26 March 2009 16:24
> To: strathspey@strathspey.org
> Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
>
> I'm in the odd situation of being in an area where there are about 8
> really good musicians to work with -- but our closest dance groups
> are all two hours drive away. One band -- no dancers!
>
> Etienne
>
>
> At 11:47 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
> >Agreed. I also know dancers who don't like dancing to fiddles because they
> >feel they don't give a clear enough beat. Personally I think there's room
> >for it all. I wish we had some good accordion bands out here, in addition
> >to all the good fiddle bands! -Steve
> >
> >On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 8:30 AM, Etienne Ozorak <etozorak@allegheny.edu>wrote:
> >
> > > Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.
> > >
> > > Etienne
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
> > >
> > >> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> >
> > >> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> > >> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
> > >> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
> > >> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
> > >> --
> > >> Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >--
> >Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
> >Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55522 · Wouter Joubert · 27 Mar 2009 12:10:09 · Top

>I also know dancers who don't like dancing to fiddles
because they feel they don't give a clear enough beat<

As I have never understood this sentiment I have over the last few years been asking around as to the reason why people say that. The persistent theory around here is that people who went through the "Rock and Roll" era never had to listen for the beat in a subtle way and, unless saved by an interest in the bigger musical picture, won't hear the rhythm so elegantly provided by flutists and fiddlers.

Wouter Joubert
Pretoria
Suid-Afrika

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55534 · Angela Bulteel · 27 Mar 2009 17:07:00 · Top

Wouter Joubert wrote >>
people who went through the "Rock and Roll" era never had to listen for
the beat in a subtle way and, unless saved by an interest in the bigger
musical picture, won't hear the rhythm so elegantly provided by flutists and
fiddlers.<<

I lived and loved the rock and roll era, and it was the beat that got to me,
and still does.!! When I started scottish country dancing and also fell for
its rythm and beat, I discovered, much to my rock'n'roll friends' horror,
that when "jiving", my feet seem naturally to move as in a strathspey step
or even surrepticiously - a modified pas de bas!!.
In one lapse of decorum, I even devised a strathspey to a slightly speeded
up version of the Everly Brothers hit of 1959 - "All I have to do is
Dream", and all this from one who recently publicly announced her
abhorrence of unrelated music being used for scottish dancing!!!!!
However, my main point I suppose is that a deep love of music is more often
than not inborn in a person-and in varying degrees, and those who choose to
explore this penchant will want to widen their passion. When I first
started dancing, the classes only used records with accordion lead bands, it
was some time later that fiddle music began to appeal to me. Now I love it,
but feel that only the very best most talented fiddlers can produce a really
strong and pronounced beat suitable for scottish dancing. While in no way
wishing to denegrate the proclivities of others,, perhaps those who prefer
accordion because they feel there isn't enough definition with fiddle do
not have such an infatuatuion with the music as others, and that dancing
comes first, music second. But I could be wrong- Its just an idea. I know
some excellent dancers who still don't fully comprehend the difference
between a reel and a jig, and would quite happily dance one to the beat of
the other, (which I would find awkward,) But their dancing suffers none
the less. I suppose it all boils down to a matter of taste, and preference.
All I do know is that if I had to choose it would be music first followed
very closely by dancing. Angela

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55524 · Etienne Ozorak · 27 Mar 2009 13:14:01 · Top

Crazy thing, that.

E

At 06:46 AM 3/27/2009, you wrote:
>I think the nearest band that that plays for us is about 2 hours
>drive away, and most
>of them have at least a five hours drive - strange thing is, most of
>them drive back
>after the dance!
>
>Malcolm
>
>Malcolm L Brown
>York (UK)
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Etienne Ozorak [mailto:etozorak@allegheny.edu]
> > Sent: 26 March 2009 16:24
> > To: strathspey@strathspey.org
> > Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
> >
> > I'm in the odd situation of being in an area where there are about 8
> > really good musicians to work with -- but our closest dance groups
> > are all two hours drive away. One band -- no dancers!
> >
> > Etienne
> >
> >
> > At 11:47 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
> > >Agreed. I also know dancers who don't like dancing to fiddles
> because they
> > >feel they don't give a clear enough beat. Personally I think there's room
> > >for it all. I wish we had some good accordion bands out here, in addition
> > >to all the good fiddle bands! -Steve
> > >
> > >On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 8:30 AM, Etienne Ozorak
> <etozorak@allegheny.edu>wrote:
> > >
> > > > Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.
> > > >
> > > > Etienne
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com>
> > > >> wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
> > > >> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say
> this is always
> > > >> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for
> less-than-rhythmic
> > > >> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
> > > >> --
> > > >> Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
> > >Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55526 · SMiskoe · 27 Mar 2009 13:48:40 · Top

Perhaps our preference to one set of instruments vs another is based on our
associations with the music we learned to dance to.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55530 · Andrew Buxton · 27 Mar 2009 16:17:42 · Top

I don't think so.  I learned to a piano but much prefer a fiddle and I love the clarinet (and unusual tunes) on the Music Makars' Catch the Wind CD.  Of course it could be a reaction against the piano :-)
 
Andrew

-----
Andrew Buxton
Lewes, East Sussex, UK

--- On Fri, 27/3/09, SMiskoe@aol.com <SMiskoe@aol.com> wrote:

From: SMiskoe@aol.com <SMiskoe@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
To: strathspey@strathspey.org
Date: Friday, 27 March, 2009, 12:48 PM

Perhaps our preference to one set of instruments vs another is based on our 
associations with the music we learned to dance to.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA


Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55533 · Miriam L. Mueller · 27 Mar 2009 16:26:47 · Top

As a light-hearted aside on Angela's comment:
Our SCD class meets in a church, and for some years the adjoining studio
housed a belly-dancing class at the same time. There we'd be, in longwise
sets of eight, and in the pause between the talk-through and our
musicians' first chord would come drifting belly-dance music. Some
interesting cross-cultural movements in those straight lines!
Mimi / Miriam Mueller San Francisco

On Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:53:44 -0000 "Angela Bulteel"
<a.bulteel@talktalk.net> writes:
>
>> Finally, as a light hearted illustration -I dont think it would go
> down
> too well if I belonged to a belly dancing group and kept trying to
> suggest
> they dance in longwise sets of eight , to Ian Mcphaill's band
> playing The
> Duke of Atholl's Reel . Angela
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________
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Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55493 · Angela Bulteel · 26 Mar 2009 18:53:44 · Top

We must all strive to be open minded, however we should all bear in mind
that many people enjoy what they have considered for some 8 decades, to
be the sound of scottish music, and the style of scottish country dancing.
The introduction or osmosis of other styles ,in either instruments, music
and /or dancing - be it american, indian, afrikan influenced and the like,
when mixed into scottish for variety, will over time inevitably change
beyond recognition, that which those at present consider the original style.
A degree of restraint is perhaps advisable. For it should be worthy of note
that if those among us incline towards a more international style of music
and dance, they have a choice, as there must be many such organizations
world wide,which are open to them. In the same vein, those who prefer what
at present is universally regarded as scottish, should have the opportunity
of preserving and enjoying their chosen style, without fear of being
labelled too purist or just plain old stick in the muds. Variety and new
ideas are to be welcomed, especially if a society or style is to continue,
but those innovations should be kept where possible,within the precepts of
what the majority might call the original style.
Today, Miss Milligan and her ideas are much maligned by some, but she did
start a great society albeit with her own interpretation of what she saw as
original scottish country dancing and it's music. This society is world
wide with many thousands of members, who belong to it because they became
interested in what and how she preserved and regulated it. Please don't let
us change it too much.
Finally, as a light hearted illustration -I dont think it would go down
too well if I belonged to a belly dancing group and kept trying to suggest
they dance in longwise sets of eight , to Ian Mcphaill's band playing The
Duke of Atholl's Reel . Angela

l Message -----
From: "Etienne Ozorak" <etozorak@allegheny.edu>
To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

> Too bad! It's nicer all around when people are open-ended in general.
>
> Etienne
>
>
> At 10:45 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>>On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 9:13 PM, Monica Pollard <sequoia03@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Now there's a "traditional" instrument I prefer *not* to hear in
>> > Scottish country dance music - a drum set. Not to say this is always
>> > the case, but sometimes it seems like a crutch for less-than-rhythmic
>> > playing, and dancing, for that matter.
>> >
>> >
>>Some people here say that about the accordion! ;-)
>>--
>>Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
>

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Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55497 · mlamontbrown · 26 Mar 2009 19:15:46 · Top

Angela wrote:

> We must all strive to be open minded, however we should all bear in mind
> that many people enjoy what they have considered for some 8 decades, to
> be the sound of Scottish music, and the style of Scottish country dancing.
......................................
> Today, Miss Milligan and her ideas are much maligned by some, but she did
> start a great society albeit with her own interpretation of what she saw as
> original Scottish country dancing and it's music.

Bobby Brown still hasn't forgiven Miss M when they met in Canada, for being less than
enthusiastic (British understatement) about the fact that he played the accordion.

I don't think we have to worry too much about losing our "traditional" sounds, as we
have recordings of what was used from the 50s onwards - I still tend to use the
Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor" when I am selecting the music - and while I
like the Society recording for "Reel of Mey", it is nowhere near the challenge it
used to be when dancing it to Jimmy Shand.

Malcolm

Malcolm L Brown
York (UK)

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55501 · Martin Campoveja · 26 Mar 2009 19:54:36 · Top

Malcolm wrote :
< the Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor"

A wonderful recording. I love it.

Martin

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55502 · Rebecca Sager · 26 Mar 2009 19:54:17 · Top

It sure is a challenge dancing The Reel of Mey to Jimmy Shand! In Book 22 it is labelled quite clearly Slow 6/8, and while the recent RSCDS recording has a pace of 36.2, Jimmy Shand's is 31.6. We practiced the dance to Jimmy Shand but danced it at the monthly Social to one of the slower recordings, to our great relief.

Becky

Becky Sager
Marietta GA USA

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "mlamontbrown" <mlamontbrown@btopenworld.com>
To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Subject: RE: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:15:46 -0000

while I
like the Society recording for "Reel of Mey", it is nowhere near the challenge it
used to be when dancing it to Jimmy Shand.

Malcolm

Malcolm L Brown
York (UK)

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55503 · Martin Campoveja · 26 Mar 2009 19:58:50 · Top

Does anyone know why the Reel of Mey and Gentle Shephard are supposed ot be
danced more slowly th

2009/3/26 Becky Sager <bsager3@juno.com>

> It sure is a challenge dancing The Reel of Mey to Jimmy Shand! In Book 22
> it is labelled quite clearly Slow 6/8, and while the recent RSCDS recording
> has a pace of 36.2, Jimmy Shand's is 31.6. We practiced the dance to Jimmy
> Shand but danced it at the monthly Social to one of the slower recordings,
> to our great relief.
>
> Becky
>
> Becky Sager
> Marietta GA USA
>
> ---------- Original Message ----------
> From: "mlamontbrown" <mlamontbrown@btopenworld.com>
> To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
> Subject: RE: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
> Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:15:46 -0000
>
> while I
> like the Society recording for "Reel of Mey", it is nowhere near the
> challenge it
> used to be when dancing it to Jimmy Shand.
>
> Malcolm
>
> Malcolm L Brown
> York (UK)
>
>

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55504 · Martin Campoveja · 26 Mar 2009 19:59:29 · Top

Does anyone know why the Reel of Mey and Gentle Shephard are supposed ot be
danced more slowly than other jigs?

Martin

The Berkeley Players

Message 55507 · John Cahill · 26 Mar 2009 20:20:42 · Top

Yes. I suspect that it was the Berkeley Players recording
of The Red House that was in great part responsible for
making it one of my favourite dances.

I have three of their records. (You remember records?
"phonograph record: sound recording consisting of a disk
with a continuous groove; used to reproduce music by
rotating while a phonograph needle tracks in the groove."
-wordnet.princeton.edu)

Did they ever make any more than three or is that it?

Cheers,

-John-

At 11:54 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>Malcolm wrote :
>< the Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor"
>
>A wonderful recording. I love it.
>
>Martin

The Berkeley Players

Message 55515 · Bruce Herbold · 27 Mar 2009 00:45:41 · Top

No just thethree but Barbara moved to Bpston and made a great album
called Gie Us Tullochgorum with a band called Tullochgprum. It is well
worth finding and clearly grew from the Berkeley experience.

Bruce Herbold
San Francisco

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 26, 2009, at 12:20 PM, John Cahill <piper824@verizon.net> wrote:

>
> Yes. I suspect that it was the Berkeley Players recording
> of The Red House that was in great part responsible for
> making it one of my favourite dances.
>
> I have three of their records. (You remember records?
> "phonograph record: sound recording consisting of a disk
> with a continuous groove; used to reproduce music by
> rotating while a phonograph needle tracks in the groove."
> -wordnet.princeton.edu)
>
> Did they ever make any more than three or is that it?
>
> Cheers,
>
> -John-
>
>
> At 11:54 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>> Malcolm wrote :
>> < the Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor"
>>
>> A wonderful recording. I love it.
>>
>> Martin
>

The Berkeley Players

Message 55516 · John Cahill · 27 Mar 2009 02:01:31 · Top

Ah, I was afraid so. Thanks for responding.
Indeed, "Gie Us Tulluchgorum" has been in the collection for a long time.
Alas, it's a cassette so it's on the list to be digitized before it turns
to. . .whatever it is tape turns to when it wears out. The definitive
version of Pinewoods Reel is on that album. For me, anyway.

Cheers,

-John-
Lakewood, California
33.8540° N, 118.1330° W
In partibus infidelium

At 04:45 PM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>No just thethree but Barbara moved to Bpston and made a great album
>called Gie Us Tullochgorum with a band called Tullochgprum. It is well
>worth finding and clearly grew from the Berkeley experience.
>
>Bruce Herbold
>San Francisco
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On Mar 26, 2009, at 12:20 PM, John Cahill <piper824@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>Yes. I suspect that it was the Berkeley Players recording
>>of The Red House that was in great part responsible for
>>making it one of my favourite dances.
>>
>>I have three of their records. (You remember records?
>>"phonograph record: sound recording consisting of a disk
>>with a continuous groove; used to reproduce music by
>>rotating while a phonograph needle tracks in the groove."
>>-wordnet.princeton.edu)
>>
>>Did they ever make any more than three or is that it?
>>
>>Cheers,
>>
>>-John-

Tulluchgorum (was The Berkeley Players)

Message 55518 · Doug Mills · 27 Mar 2009 05:07:09 · Top

And the Tulluchgorum recording of The Highlandman Kissed his Mother is
brilliant.

Doug Mills
Christchurch
NZ

John Cahill wrote:
>
..The definitive version of Pinewoods Reel is on that album. For me, anyway.
>

The Berkeley Players

Message 55517 · Noel Chavez · 27 Mar 2009 02:31:44 · Top

Barbara McOwen has released other recordings, such as Dances Frae the
North, and Muckle Carrfuffle, as well as cuts on Boston 50th and San
Francisco vol 2. Barbara has been key in teaching the art of Scottish
fiddling to many on both coasts of the US and in between, generously
sharing her time and expertise. She also has worked with fiddlers such as
Angus Grant of Scotland to help get his tunes and technique documented for
others to use. Many of us can trace our Scottish music interests and
skills to Barbara.
Noel Chavez, Chicago
On Thu, March 26, 2009 6:45 pm, Bruce wrote:
> No just thethree but Barbara moved to Bpston and made a great album
> called Gie Us Tullochgorum with a band called Tullochgprum. It is well
> worth finding and clearly grew from the Berkeley experience.
>
> Bruce Herbold
> San Francisco
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 26, 2009, at 12:20 PM, John Cahill <piper824@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Yes. I suspect that it was the Berkeley Players recording
>> of The Red House that was in great part responsible for
>> making it one of my favourite dances.
>>
>> I have three of their records. (You remember records?
>> "phonograph record: sound recording consisting of a disk
>> with a continuous groove; used to reproduce music by
>> rotating while a phonograph needle tracks in the groove."
>> -wordnet.princeton.edu)
>>
>> Did they ever make any more than three or is that it?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> -John-
>>
>>
>> At 11:54 AM 3/26/2009, you wrote:
>>> Malcolm wrote :
>>> < the Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor"
>>>
>>> A wonderful recording. I love it.
>>>
>>> Martin
>>
>

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55510 · Angela Bulteel · 26 Mar 2009 22:51:14 · Top

Malcolm, I'd heard this about Miss M before. I never knew her but my
husband did and he sometimes recalls her being a real pedant, with somewhat
dogmatic ideas, rules etc.Miss Milligan was his examiner when he took his
cerificate, Mrs Gudyer his teacher, way back in the early 60s.
I too appreciate the Berkley Players by the way. We also have a couple of
those old discs that go round and round with a needle stuck in them.
Angela

----- Original Message -----
From: "mlamontbrown" <mlamontbrown@btopenworld.com>
To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:15 PM
Subject: RE: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)............................
.
>
> Bobby Brown still hasn't forgiven Miss M when they met in Canada, for
> being less than
> enthusiastic (British understatement) about the fact that he played the
> accordion.
>
> I don't think we have to worry too much about losing our "traditional"
> sounds, as we
> have recordings of what was used from the 50s onwards - I still tend to
> use the
> Berkley Players recording of "The Sailor" when I am selecting the music -
> and while I
> like the Society recording for "Reel of Mey", it is nowhere near the
> challenge it
> used to be when dancing it to Jimmy Shand.
>
> Malcolm
>
> Malcolm L Brown
> York (UK)
>
>
>
>

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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07:12:00

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55511 · Iain Boyd · 26 Mar 2009 22:51:24 · Top

Dear Sylvia,

I was very interested in your comment -

"When I first began playing SCD I was told that only Scots, born in  Scotland,
could properly play the music."

When I started devising new dances I was told that only Scots, born in Scotland, could really appreciate SCD and could devise dances in the same style. (I am a fourth generation New Zealander and the other person an immigrant Scot.)

Regards,

Iain Boyd

Postal Address -

P O Box 11-404

Wellington 6142

New Zealand

Get the world&#39;s best email - http://nz.mail.yahoo.com/

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55512 · Anselm Lingnau · 26 Mar 2009 23:37:42 · Top

Iain Boyd wrote:

> When I started devising new dances I was told that only Scots, born in
> Scotland, could really appreciate SCD and could devise dances in the same
> style.

They wish. Of course this conveniently disregards the fact that country
dancing had been going like gangbusters for a century or so before the Scots
got into the game at all. On the other hand, it already represents a big step
onward from the once-popular conviction that devising new dances at all was a
kind of blasphemy against the old books.

Also, when we compare the demographic make-up of the SCD communities in
Scotland and elsewhere, it seems more than likely that SCD will continue
happily all over the world long after the last true »Scot, born in Scotland«
to actually practice it has shuffled off their mortal coil.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany ..................... anselm@strathspey.org
Now is better than never. Although never is often better than *right* now.
-- Tim Peters, _The Zen of Python_

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55520 · Pia Walker · 27 Mar 2009 09:04:34 · Top

NO that's not true - we are a few imported foreigners who will keep it going
here :>)

Pia

-----Original Message-----
From: Anselm Lingnau [mailto:anselm@strathspey.org]
Sent: 26 March 2009 22:38
To: strathspey@strathspey.org
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Iain Boyd wrote:

> When I started devising new dances I was told that only Scots, born in
> Scotland, could really appreciate SCD and could devise dances in the same
> style.

They wish. Of course this conveniently disregards the fact that country
dancing had been going like gangbusters for a century or so before the Scots
got into the game at all. On the other hand, it already represents a big
step
onward from the once-popular conviction that devising new dances at all was
a
kind of blasphemy against the old books.

Also, when we compare the demographic make-up of the SCD communities in
Scotland and elsewhere, it seems more than likely that SCD will continue
happily all over the world long after the last true »Scot, born in Scotland«
to actually practice it has shuffled off their mortal coil.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Friedberg, Germany .....................
anselm@strathspey.org
Now is better than never. Although never is often better than *right* now.
-- Tim Peters, _The Zen of
Python_

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55499 · Pia Walker · 26 Mar 2009 19:51:04 · Top

But boy would it liven up SCD :>) Ehm! She says looking down - perhaps
not.

Pia

Finally, as a light hearted illustration -I dont think it would go down
too well if I belonged to a belly dancing group and kept trying to suggest
they dance in longwise sets of eight , to Ian Mcphaill's band playing The
Duke of Atholl's Reel . Angela

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55508 · Angela Bulteel · 26 Mar 2009 22:31:04 · Top

Guess we have the same problem Pia.!!! Angela

----- Original Message -----
From: "Pia" <pia@intamail.com>
To: <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:51 PM
Subject: RE: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

> But boy would it liven up SCD :>) Ehm! She says looking down - perhaps
> not.
>
> Pia
>
> Finally, as a light hearted illustration -I dont think it would go down
> too well if I belonged to a belly dancing group and kept trying to suggest
> they dance in longwise sets of eight , to Ian Mcphaill's band playing The
> Duke of Atholl's Reel . Angela
>
>
>
>

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55509 · Rebecca Sager · 26 Mar 2009 22:37:20 · Top

Hmm... I never met an ex-patriot Scot. Most I know believe no other country can hold a candle to the land of their birth. Expatriates, though, a bodacious plenty of them. Picky, picky...

Becky

Becky Sager
Marietta GA USA

From: SMiskoe@aol.com
To: strathspey@strathspey.org
Subject: Re: Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:06:22 EDT
The bravery comes from 40 years ago when I was trying to introduce live
music into Boston and nobody believed Americans could play it. SCD became
popular in the first place because there were so many ex-patriot Scots who wanted
to continue dancing.
Cheers,
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55513 · Steve Wyrick · 27 Mar 2009 00:03:37 · Top

Regarding innovation, the RSCDS has often borrowed from other traditions for
the tunes (although they have stuck mainly to the British Isles). And there
was innovation and evolution in instrumentation in the past or we would
still be dancing to fiddle & cello rather than accordions and snares!
[Actually, I recall reading a comment from a viol player writing in the
1600s(I think?) complaining that the recent popularity of the violin was
destroying the character of Scottish music! 'Twas ever thus...] I'm a
traditionalist (1790s rather than 1920s is my favored era) but I do think
there's room for further innovation as long as the essential character of
the music is preserved--there's a can of worms for you! At any rate I don't
think it's worth worrying about too much; these issues tend to be
self-regulating.

Speaking of belly dance, recently we dined at a Moroccan restaurant that
normally features traditional dancers but that night happened to be a yearly
event hosted by a local belly dance school where students got up and
performed routines they'd choreographed to non-traditional music--Country
Western, Rap, Salsa, etc. (Nobody used the Duke of Atholl's Reel,
thankfully...) Most routines were not very successful in our opinion,
because the chosen music didn't fit the character of the dance very well.
Our favorite used what sounded to me like some sort of Arabian
techno-fusion, and showed that it just might be possible to use other
appropriate music while still keeping the essence and spirit of traditional
dance intact! -Steve

On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Angela Bulteel <a.bulteel@talktalk.net>wrote:

>
> We must all strive to be open minded, however we should all bear in mind
> that many people enjoy what they have considered for some 8 decades, to
> be the sound of scottish music, and the style of scottish country dancing.
> The introduction or osmosis of other styles ,in either instruments, music
> and /or dancing - be it american, indian, afrikan influenced and the like,
> when mixed into scottish for variety, will over time inevitably change
> beyond recognition, that which those at present consider the original style.
> A degree of restraint is perhaps advisable. For it should be worthy of note
> that if those among us incline towards a more international style of music
> and dance, they have a choice, as there must be many such organizations
> world wide,which are open to them. In the same vein, those who prefer what
> at present is universally regarded as scottish, should have the opportunity
> of preserving and enjoying their chosen style, without fear of being
> labelled too purist or just plain old stick in the muds. Variety and new
> ideas are to be welcomed, especially if a society or style is to continue,
> but those innovations should be kept where possible,within the precepts of
> what the majority might call the original style.
> Today, Miss Milligan and her ideas are much maligned by some, but she did
> start a great society albeit with her own interpretation of what she saw as
> original scottish country dancing and it's music. This society is world
> wide with many thousands of members, who belong to it because they became
> interested in what and how she preserved and regulated it. Please don't let
> us change it too much.
> Finally, as a light hearted illustration -I dont think it would go down
> too well if I belonged to a belly dancing group and kept trying to suggest
> they dance in longwise sets of eight , to Ian Mcphaill's band playing The
> Duke of Atholl's Reel . Angela
>

--
Steve Wyrick -- Walnut Creek, California
Sent from: Berkeley California United States.

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55514 · Angela Bulteel · 27 Mar 2009 00:18:30 · Top

Steve, I found your words reassuring,especially the bit about things being
self regulating. I'm So glad your belly dancers didnt use the Duke of
Atholls Reel as you might be wondering what some of us get up to in our our
spare time!!! Angela

Essence of SCD (was changing tunes)

Message 55519 · campbell · 27 Mar 2009 08:28:15 · Top

Angela wrote:

Steve, I found your words reassuring,especially the bit about things being
self regulating. I'm So glad your belly dancers didnt use the Duke of
Atholls Reel as you might be wondering what some of us get up to in our our
spare time!!!

I wont try it though because I sense my belly would be self-regulating too.

Campbell

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