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"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47589 · Parbleuoui · 14 Dec 2006 20:20:33 · Top

Hello George,

there is another one, 8x40 - 3cpl (4cpl set) but this is a Jig! And it is
from Martin Sheffield.

cheers

Gabrielle

Germany

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47590 · Peter Price · 14 Dec 2006 20:33:51 · Top

I would be interested in a copy of this dance.

Peter Price
New Haven, Ct.

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47591 · George Meikle · 14 Dec 2006 23:54:21 · Top

Gabrielle,

Thanks for the information about the jig but I was already well aware of
that dance and it is also in the database. It was the Strathspey which was
causing the problem but I have now managed to confirm that it is definitely
a 3x40S and not 8x40S as in DanceData.

Kind regards
George

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47594 · Alan Paterson · 15 Dec 2006 09:00:41 · Top

On 14/12/2006 23:54, George Meikle wrote:
> Gabrielle,
>
> Thanks for the information about the jig but I was already well aware of
> that dance and it is also in the database. It was the Strathspey which was
> causing the problem but I have now managed to confirm that it is definitely
> a 3x40S and not 8x40S as in DanceData.

(Alan being pedantic)

1. Dancedata has NO dances as 8x32. What was stored for this dance was
that it should be danced in a 4-couple set. (However many times it is
danced is up to the dancers).

2. I have corrected this dance now to be a 3-couple set (dance it 3
times, 6 times or 9 times - up to you).

Alan :-)

--
Alan Paterson
Berne, Switzerland

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47595 · George Meikle · 15 Dec 2006 10:37:42 · Top

(Alan being pedantic) wrote:

> 1. Dancedata has NO dances as 8x32. What was stored for this dance
> was that it should be danced in a 4-couple set. (However many times
> it is danced is up to the dancers).

> 2. I have corrected this dance now to be a 3-couple set (dance it
> 3 times, 6 times or 9 times - up to you).

Alan,

I am sorry, but my reading of the dance shows that DanceData was incorrect.
Having seen the dance instructions, they quite clearly state at the top that
it is a "40 bar Strathspey for a 3 couple set". DanceData was showing it as
a "Longwise - 4" set, hence the probable reason you decide to correct it I
assume. At the foot of the instructions it then states that you should
"Repeat 2 more turns of the dance".

You state that "DanceData has NO dances as 8x32 and that what was stored for
this dance was that it should be danced in a 4-couple set" which as I have
explained above is actually wrong.

Like the vast majority of musicians, if not all, on seeing a dance written
as "3 couples" in a "Longwise - 4" I would interpret that in the VAST
majority of cases to mean an 8x?? dance and certainly not a 3x?? dance. If
you are trying to tell me that every dance described as such in DanceDate is
actually 3x?? then some drastic rework is required for the VAST majority of
dances shown in your database - I must remember to play Montgomeries Rant as
3x32R the next time it is on a programme! If this is indeed the case, then
some form of clarification is required, otherwise the data is of no use to
musicians at all.

Maybe that explains why so many musicians in Scotland use the Sutton Index
instead?

Kind regards (and certainly not being pedantic!)
George Meikle
Dunfermline, Scotland

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47596 · Alan Paterson · 15 Dec 2006 11:01:50 · Top

On 15/12/2006 10:37, George Meikle wrote:
> (Alan being pedantic) wrote:
>
>> 1. Dancedata has NO dances as 8x32. What was stored for this dance
>> was that it should be danced in a 4-couple set. (However many times
>> it is danced is up to the dancers).
>
>> 2. I have corrected this dance now to be a 3-couple set (dance it
>> 3 times, 6 times or 9 times - up to you).
>
> Alan,
>
> I am sorry, but my reading of the dance shows that DanceData was incorrect.

Which I am not disputing in the slightest.

> Having seen the dance instructions, they quite clearly state at the top that
> it is a "40 bar Strathspey for a 3 couple set". DanceData was showing it as
> a "Longwise - 4" set, hence the probable reason you decide to correct it I
> assume. At the foot of the instructions it then states that you should
> "Repeat 2 more turns of the dance".
>
> You state that "DanceData has NO dances as 8x32 and that what was stored for
> this dance was that it should be danced in a 4-couple set" which as I have
> explained above is actually wrong.

Which, as I have explained, I believe without hesitation.

> Like the vast majority of musicians, if not all, on seeing a dance written
> as "3 couples" in a "Longwise - 4" I would interpret that in the VAST
> majority of cases to mean an 8x?? dance and certainly not a 3x?? dance.

Correct.

> If
> you are trying to tell me that every dance described as such in DanceDate is
> actually 3x?? then some drastic rework is required for the VAST majority of
> dances shown in your database - I must remember to play Montgomeries Rant as
> 3x32R the next time it is on a programme! If this is indeed the case, then
> some form of clarification is required, otherwise the data is of no use to
> musicians at all.

Not in the slightest. Read again what I wrote - I HAD MADE A MISTAKE.
The dance is NOT a 4-couple set. It is a 3-couple set.

> Maybe that explains why so many musicians in Scotland use the Sutton Index
> instead?

Low blow George.

The data in Dancedata is as accurate as I can make it. I only have
original instructions for about 4,000 of the 13,000 dances, so if
someone tells me something wrong, then - so be it.

> Kind regards (and certainly not being pedantic!)

But misunderstanding my post ever so slightly.

I'm sorry. Perhaps I should explain more clearly what my post was really
trying to get across. I was just implying it before.

DanceData has NO information which says how often a dance is to be
danced through. So please do not try to tell me "Dancedata says it is
8x32". What it DOES have is the information on how many couples dance
ONCE through and it also has the required number of couples in a set. OF
COURSE, it is normal that a 3- or 2- couple dance in a 4-couple set gets
danced 8 times. But it is not compulsary. On an encore, exactly the same
dance will get done only 4 times. If we have a 5 couple set, I may
decide to put on music which goes 10 times through. 3-couple-sets may
often get danced 6 times - or maybe 3. a 4-couple set will usually be
done 4 times - but. if it is a popular dance - perhaps 8? Again - this
is not an attribute of the dance itself, it is a convention.

> George Meikle
> Dunfermline, Scotland
>

Alan
--
Alan Paterson
Berne, Switzerland

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47601 · Anselm Lingnau · 15 Dec 2006 21:01:55 · Top

Alan Paterson wrote:

> The data in Dancedata is as accurate as I can make it. I only have
> original instructions for about 4,000 of the 13,000 dances, so if
> someone tells me something wrong, then - so be it.

Here's where YOU (the community of DanceData users) come in. DanceData does
list whether a dance has been checked against the original instructions. If
you find an unchecked dance and do have the original instructions around
(e.g., if you're preparing to teach that dance anyway), then please let us
know that the dance's listing in DanceData is, in fact, correct according to
the original, or what is wrong or missing. You can either tell Alan directly
or, if you're using the World Wide Web version that I maintain, use
the »comment to database maintainers« facility to submit a comment which I
shall collect and forward to him. The same goes, of course, for errors in
dances that have purportedly been checked already.

Actually, now that winter is upon us (in the Northern Hemisphere), why not
snuggle up of a rainy Sunday afternoon with your favourite non-verified dance
book and go over a bunch of dances for us? That would be a very good deed,
and remember that Christmas is the holiday of peace and good will etc.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Frankfurt, Germany ..................... anselm@strathspey.org
It's really scary how many major business decisions which affect your job,
your investments, or your market, are taken daily on the basis of half-truths
and ill-informed opinion simply because no-one thought to check the facts.
-- Peter Flynn

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47602 · Brian Charlton · 15 Dec 2006 23:35:00 · Top

Thanks, Anselm.

All those persons who note an error in such resources (DanceData, Minicrib,
Napier's Index, Society publications, etc), should send details of the
error/omission to the originator. I am sure that they welcome the comments
and the rest of us also benefit.

By the way, George, how does one get a copy of the Sutton Coldfield Index?

Brian Charlton,
Sydney, Australia

On 12/16/06, Anselm Lingnau <anselm@strathspey.org> wrote:
>
> Alan Paterson wrote:
>
> > The data in Dancedata is as accurate as I can make it. I only have
> > original instructions for about 4,000 of the 13,000 dances, so if
> > someone tells me something wrong, then - so be it.
>
> Here's where YOU (the community of DanceData users) come in. DanceData
> does
> list whether a dance has been checked against the original instructions.
> If
> you find an unchecked dance and do have the original instructions around
> (e.g., if you're preparing to teach that dance anyway), then please let us
> know that the dance's listing in DanceData is, in fact, correct according
> to
> the original, or what is wrong or missing. You can either tell Alan
> directly
> or, if you're using the World Wide Web version that I maintain, use
> the »comment to database maintainers« facility to submit a comment which I
> shall collect and forward to him. The same goes, of course, for errors in
> dances that have purportedly been checked already.
>
> Actually, now that winter is upon us (in the Northern Hemisphere), why not
> snuggle up of a rainy Sunday afternoon with your favourite non-verified
> dance
> book and go over a bunch of dances for us? That would be a very good deed,
> and remember that Christmas is the holiday of peace and good will etc.
>
> Anselm
> --
> Anselm Lingnau, Frankfurt, Germany .....................
> anselm@strathspey.org
> It's really scary how many major business decisions which affect your job,
> your investments, or your market, are taken daily on the basis of
> half-truths
> and ill-informed opinion simply because no-one thought to check the facts.
> -- Peter
> Flynn
>

Sutton Coldfield Dance Index

Message 47603 · George Meikle · 17 Dec 2006 16:04:35 · Top

Brian,

The Sutton Coldfield Index is available from the RSCDS Sutton Coldfield
Branch. If you contact Carol Anderson on GRACAR@aol.com I am sure she will
be happy to give you whatever details you require as to availability and
costs etc.

Kind regards
George Meikle
Dunfermline, Scotland

Brian Charlton wrote:-

> By the way, George, how does one get a copy of the Sutton Coldfield Index?

> Brian Charlton,
> Sydney, Australia

Sutton Coldfield Dance Index

Message 47604 · Iain Boyd · 17 Dec 2006 21:06:23 · Top

George,

Is the index available in an electronic form?

Iain Boyd


George Meikle <george.meikle@btinternet.com> wrote:
Brian,

The Sutton Coldfield Index is available from the RSCDS Sutton Coldfield
Branch. If you contact Carol Anderson on GRACAR@aol.com I am sure she will
be happy to give you whatever details you require as to availability and
costs etc.

Kind regards
George Meikle
Dunfermline, Scotland

Brian Charlton wrote:-

> By the way, George, how does one get a copy of the Sutton Coldfield Index?

> Brian Charlton,
> Sydney, Australia

Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com

Sutton Coldfield Dance Index

Message 47605 · George Meikle · 17 Dec 2006 22:30:08 · Top

Iain Boyd wrote:-

> Is the index available in an electronic form?

Sorry but it is not currently available in an electronic format.

Kind regards
George Meikle
Dunfermline, Scotland

Sutton Coldfield Dance Index

Message 47611 · Peter Price · 18 Dec 2006 21:31:48 · Top

George,

In Leaflet 33, The RSCDS published a 40 bar jig, The Colonel. Music was a 3
part 6/8 jig from Young's Collection of 1740.

In browsing a web site called "The Fiddler's Companion" I found the
following reference:

*COLONEL [2]**, THE.* Scottish, Country Dance Tune (9/8 time). The air along
with dance instructions appears in the *Bodleian Manuscript* (kept at
Bodleian Library, Oxford), entitled "A Collection of the Newest Country
Dances Performed in Scotland written at Edinburgh by D.A. Young, W.M. 1740."

Is this a case of Headquarters publishing a revision without acknowledging
the fact that they have rewritten the tune from 9/8 to 6/8?

Peter Price
New Haven, Ct.

Sutton Coldfield Dance Index

Message 47613 · Peter McClure · 18 Dec 2006 23:40:33 · Top

>George,
>
>In Leaflet 33, The RSCDS published a 40 bar jig, The Colonel. Music was a 3
>part 6/8 jig from Young's Collection of 1740.
>
>In browsing a web site called "The Fiddler's Companion" I found the
>following reference:
>
>*COLONEL [2]**, THE.* Scottish, Country Dance Tune (9/8 time). The air along
>with dance instructions appears in the *Bodleian Manuscript* (kept at
>Bodleian Library, Oxford), entitled "A Collection of the Newest Country
>Dances Performed in Scotland written at Edinburgh by D.A. Young, W.M. 1740."
>
>Is this a case of Headquarters publishing a revision without acknowledging
>the fact that they have rewritten the tune from 9/8 to 6/8?

Well, I don't know about "acknowledging", but the 75th anniversary
magazine, which, if memory serves, included Lflt 33, had on its back
cover a photo reproduction of the original tune, which was quite
clear enough to allow it to be played. I recall that there was some
comment at the time about it being too bad to have to hack the
original to 6/8.

Peter McClure
Winnipeg, MB

The Collonel

Message 47614 · ron.mackey · 19 Dec 2006 00:50:36 · Top

> Well, I don't know about "acknowledging", but the 75th anniversary
> magazine, which, if memory serves, included Lflt 33, had on its back
> cover a photo reproduction of the original tune, which was quite
> clear enough to allow it to be played. I recall that there was some
> comment at the time about it being too bad to have to hack the
> original to 6/8.
>
> Peter McClure
> Winnipeg, MB

Hi, Peters
It also shows the original dance and does say after the
quoted passage - 'We hope you will find it interesting to compare these
instructions with our interpretation.'
I assume that includes the music. I seem to remember that at
Summer School someone asked why the original version of the tune had not
been used and the answer was something like:-
1. It was felt that many SCD musicians would be unfamiliar with 9/8 time and
the revised version would be more in keeping with what they are used to.
2. 9/8 music to match would be more difficult to find for many who do not
have a deep knowledge or capability to do the necessary music research.
It was published in 1998 and we are inclined to forget that even as
short a time ago as that fewer were able to use the computer for such
research is seems to be 'commonplace' today. In fact I'm pretty sure that at
least one who had something to do with the music has no knowledge of
computing at all.
In the Seniors Class we were played the 9/8 version and it seemed
to be great music to dance to.

Oh yes. The spelling of the 'subject' line is the one on the
manuscript.

Happy Dancing
Ron

London, Croydon and International Branches

The Collonel

Message 47617 · Mike Briggs · 19 Dec 2006 02:28:39 · Top

With 'The Colonel (collonel?)," as people have said, the Society
acknowledged altering the signature of the recommended tune from 9/8 to
6/8. IMHO, the change was made because it's not feasible to dance skip
change of step in anything but duple time (2/4, 4/4, 6/8). In triple
time (3/4, 9/8), all that works is a walking or running step (see also
'Drops of Brandy').

For those who're interested, check the tune for 'Jubilee Jig' (Miss
Gordon of Liverpool). Marshall wrote it as a 9/8 jig. The Society
turned it into a 6/8, without acknowledging that it had done so. It's a
nice (and by now) very well-known tune in 6/8, but it would be nice if
such alterations were uniformly acknowledged.

Mike

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Norma and Mike Briggs
BRIGGS LAW OFFICE
1519 Storytown Road
Oregon WI 53575-2521 USA
Voice: 608 835 0914
Fax: 608 835 0924
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

The Collonel

Message 47618 · John Chambers · 19 Dec 2006 02:44:54 · Top

Mike Briggs wrote:
|
| For those who're interested, check the tune for 'Jubilee Jig' (Miss
| Gordon of Liverpool). Marshall wrote it as a 9/8 jig. The Society
| turned it into a 6/8, without acknowledging that it had done so. It's a
| nice (and by now) very well-known tune in 6/8, but it would be nice if
| such alterations were uniformly acknowledged.

A few months ago, one of the local dance leaders sent me a program
that included a dance with "Jig" in its name, with the comment that
any good jigs would do, but she liked it to Soldier's Joy. My first
reaction was "Huh??? That's THE stereotyped traditional reel tune."
But then I thought about it a bit, and found that this chestnut can
be easily turned into a jig. So I played it that way, and she was
quite happy with it.

(I haven't verified that she actually knows the difference. ;-)

--
What if the Hoky Poky really IS what it's all about?

The Collonel

Message 47640 · Bryan McAlister · 20 Dec 2006 10:13:00 · Top

Some dancers can't tell the difference and go purely by the name. Maybe
the RSCDS needs to include "Butterfly" and "Caterpiller "in their
manual:-)

In message <20061119024454.19053.jc@trillian.mit.edu>, John Chambers
<jc@trillian.mit.edu> writes
>Mike Briggs wrote:
>|
>| For those who're interested, check the tune for 'Jubilee Jig' (Miss
>| Gordon of Liverpool). Marshall wrote it as a 9/8 jig. The Society
>| turned it into a 6/8, without acknowledging that it had done so. It's a
>| nice (and by now) very well-known tune in 6/8, but it would be nice if
>| such alterations were uniformly acknowledged.
>
>A few months ago, one of the local dance leaders sent me a program
>that included a dance with "Jig" in its name, with the comment that
>any good jigs would do, but she liked it to Soldier's Joy. My first
>reaction was "Huh??? That's THE stereotyped traditional reel tune."
>But then I thought about it a bit, and found that this chestnut can
>be easily turned into a jig. So I played it that way, and she was
>quite happy with it.
>
>(I haven't verified that she actually knows the difference. ;-)
>
>
>--
>What if the Hoky Poky really IS what it's all about?
>

--
Bryan McAlister

The Collonel

Message 47616 · John Chambers · 19 Dec 2006 00:54:54 · Top

Ron wrote:
| 1. It was felt that many SCD musicians would be unfamiliar with 9/8
| time and the revised version would be more in keeping with what
| they are used to.

Well, I know lots of slip jigs, but then, I've also played a lot of
Irish music. I'll bet that this is true of a large fraction of the
world's SCD musicians, including those in Scotland. It'd be nice to
have dances that call for some of these great tunes.

| 2. 9/8 music to match would be more difficult to find for many who
| do not have a deep knowledge or capability to do the necessary
| music research.

If you have a copy of O'Neill's "1850", you have 50 slip jigs right
there. We all have a copy of that tome, right? (If not, it's all
online at several sites now. ;-)

| In the Seniors Class we were played the 9/8 version and it seemed
| to be great music to dance to.

Does anyone have a copy (scanned image, ABC, whatever) of it to share
with the rest of us?

| Oh yes. The spelling of the 'subject' line is the one on the
| manuscript.

One of the main things that can make it difficult to find tunes. The
other main thing is the common tendency to make up new titles for any
reason, or for no reason at all.

--
What if the Hoky Poky really IS what it's all about?

The Collonel

Message 47622 · Steve Wyrick · 19 Dec 2006 06:06:50 · Top

John Chambers wrote:

> | In the Seniors Class we were played the 9/8 version and it seemed
> | to be great music to dance to.
>
> Does anyone have a copy (scanned image, ABC, whatever) of it to share
> with the rest of us?

Here you go, John:

X: 1
T: The Collonel
C: David Young, 1740
S: "A Collection of the Newest Country Dances..."
R: slip jig
Z: Steve Wyrick
M: 9/8
L: 1/8
K: G
|:c|(B/c/d)B dBG G2g|(e/f/g)e dBG TA2c|(B/c/d)B dBG G2B|TA3AFD D2:|!
|:c|TB2E (EF)E (EF)E|TB2E (EF)E D2c|TB2E EFE EFG|ABA AFD D2:|!
|:c|Bcd dBG Bcd|efg dBG ABc|Bcd dBG Bcd|ABA AFD D2:|!
|:c|TBAB EFE EFE|BAB EFE D2c|TBAB EFE EFG |ABA AFD D2:|]!

[For anyone who doesn't know what to do with the above, cut and paste the
above code into the window at http://www.concertina.net/tunes_convert.html ,
hit "submit" and you'll see a copy of the jig in standard notation, which
can then be saved as PDF or played as a MIDI file.]

This is a neat little tune! I'll have to see if I can find somewhere to use
it. -Steve
--
Steve Wyrick -- Concord, California

The Collonel

Message 47626 · Ian Brockbank · 19 Dec 2006 15:42:24 · Top

Ron wrote:
> 1. It was felt that many SCD musicians would be unfamiliar with 9/8
> time and the revised version would be more in keeping with what
> they are used to.

And what about the dancers? What step would we use? Skip-skip-change?
Or skip-change, and just ignore the bar lines? Or some other step?

It would have been a brave step to introduce a new concept like this,
and much less likely for it to have been danced (except by the
adventurous
advanced dancers).

Cheers,

Ian Brockbank
Edinburgh, Scotland
ian@scottishdance.net
http://www.scottishdance.net/

The Collonel

Message 47628 · SMiskoe · 19 Dec 2006 16:10:58 · Top


In a message dated 12/19/2006 9:44:45 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Ian.Brockbank@wolfsonmicro.com writes:

And what about the dancers? What step would we use? Skip-skip-change?
Or skip-change, and just ignore the bar lines? Or some other step?

How about the running step? Certainly the dancers are capable to learning a
new step, and might enjoy that challenge.
It would be a huge step, no pun intended, to start that change.
Muriel Johnstone has recorded Mr Wilson's Hornpipe, Miss Ann Cameron's Jig
and Miss Gordon of Liverpool with the note that these tunes cry out for a
revival of 9/8 rhythm in SCD. Perhaps now with the help of the internet we can
take that step.
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

The Collonel

Message 47629 · Anselm Lingnau · 19 Dec 2006 17:14:06 · Top

Sylvia Miskoe <SMiskoe@aol.com> wrote:

> How about the running step? Certainly the dancers are capable to learning
> a new step, and might enjoy that challenge.

I have inflicted running-step dances on my group at various times and the
reactions usually range from puzzlement to groans.

> Muriel Johnstone has recorded Mr Wilson's Hornpipe, Miss Ann Cameron's Jig
> and Miss Gordon of Liverpool with the note that these tunes cry out for a
> revival of 9/8 rhythm in SCD. Perhaps now with the help of the internet we
> can take that step.

The other obvious »9/8« dance/tune that comes to mind is »Woo'd and Married
And A'«. The problem with dancing this using running steps to 9/8 music is
probably what to do about the poussette.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau, Frankfurt, Germany ..................... anselm@strathspey.org
However rare true love may be, it is less so than true friendship.
-- François, Duc de La Rochefoucauld

The Collonel

Message 47631 · SMiskoe · 19 Dec 2006 21:27:38 · Top


In a message dated 12/19/2006 2:37:11 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
anselm@strathspey.org writes:

The problem with dancing this using running steps to 9/8 music is
probably what to do about the poussette.

Correct me if this doesn't work, but:
Many 9/8 tunes are in 4 bar phrases. 1 bar (3 beats) for each part of the
pousette, the running step is a gentle jog. The English dancers do it, are
the Scots going to be upstaged by the English?
Sylvia Miskoe, Concord, NH USA

The Collonel

Message 47632 · Peter Price · 19 Dec 2006 23:32:22 · Top

Some thing of a plug - I use the program "Barfly" to play and display ABC
tunes - it will even display and print in standard stave notation. I am
currently playing with the multi-voice feature and hearing the tunes played
by a "band" of 2 violins, piano left & right hand, and percussion.

In regards to dancing to slip jigs - a gentle running step works, so does a
skip change and skip. The down side of the later is that you don't change
leading foot. The extra skip puts you back on the right foot. IE right close
right and skip (left) , right close right and skip (left), etc. Unbalanced
and rather tiring for a whole dance, but doable.

I have always felt that the rigidity of standardization by the RSCDS was
limiting. It effectively removes from our dance world all those wonderful
rhythms and tunes that don't dance to 2/4 or 4/4 stepping. Slip jigs, 3/2
hornpipes (Cam' ye ower from France) etc.
The RSCDS' constitutional mandate was to "preserve" the music and dancing of
Scotland. To
me, that includes _all_ the rhythms, even the 'odd' ones. Rewriting tunes to
fit our contrived standard seems a bit paradoxical. It creates a revisionist
history, if you will, but it is not an accurate history. And the cost of it!

There are several danaces in RSCDS Books in 3/4 time. When last has anyone
dance them? The Yellow Haired Laddie for example...

Peter Price
New Haven, Ct.

The Collonel

Message 47634 · ron.mackey · 20 Dec 2006 00:30:15 · Top

> There are several danaces in RSCDS Books in 3/4 time. When last has anyone
> dance them? The Yellow Haired Laddie for example...
>
> Peter Price
> New Haven, Ct.

This year at StAndrews!
R

The Collonel

Message 47641 · Steve Wyrick · 20 Dec 2006 15:47:02 · Top

Peter Price wrote:

> Some thing of a plug - I use the program "Barfly" to play and display ABC
> tunes - it will even display and print in standard stave notation. I am
> currently playing with the multi-voice feature and hearing the tunes played
> by a "band" of 2 violins, piano left & right hand, and percussion.

BarFly is a great program; it's handy for composition because it shows the
results of your code in standard notation as you type it in. It has been a
favorite of mine for several years. Unfortunately for Windows users, so far
it's Mac only!

>
> I have always felt that the rigidity of standardization by the RSCDS was
> limiting. It effectively removes from our dance world all those wonderful
> rhythms and tunes that don't dance to 2/4 or 4/4 stepping. Slip jigs, 3/2
> hornpipes (Cam' ye ower from France) etc.
> The RSCDS' constitutional mandate was to "preserve" the music and dancing of
> Scotland. To
> me, that includes _all_ the rhythms, even the 'odd' ones. Rewriting tunes to
> fit our contrived standard seems a bit paradoxical. It creates a revisionist
> history, if you will, but it is not an accurate history. And the cost of it!

This is why I like fiddling for (Scottish) step dancers! We play a much
wider variety of tune styles for them than for SCD--although I can't think
of any 3/2 hornpipes offhand...

>
> There are several danaces in RSCDS Books in 3/4 time. When last has anyone
> danced them? The Yellow Haired Laddie for example...

Waltz Country Dance is frequently on programs here, if that counts!
--
Steve Wyrick -- Concord, California

The Collonel

Message 47636 · John Chambers · 20 Dec 2006 02:50:47 · Top

Peter Price pronounced:
| I have always felt that the rigidity of standardization by the RSCDS was
| limiting. It effectively removes from our dance world all those wonderful
| rhythms and tunes that don't dance to 2/4 or 4/4 stepping. Slip jigs, 3/2
| hornpipes (Cam' ye ower from France) etc.
| The RSCDS' constitutional mandate was to "preserve" the music and dancing of
| Scotland. To
| me, that includes _all_ the rhythms, even the 'odd' ones. Rewriting tunes to
| fit our contrived standard seems a bit paradoxical. It creates a revisionist
| history, if you will, but it is not an accurate history. And the cost of it!

Well, I'd only half agree. It is somewhat a pity that slip jigs were
lost from the RSCDS repertoire. They probably could be easily
recovered. Just consult with a few step dancers (Scottish and Irish)
for ideas about the steps; they dance to slip jigs and can show you
the footwork.

But it's rather pointless to complain about revising tunes to fit the
requirements of a dance. That is a universal fact of life for dance
musicians. People are always learning good tunes that they'd like to
use for a dance. Many kinds of dance have strict requirements for
phrasing, tempo, etc. A good dance musician will understand this, and
will make whatever changes are necessary. If it requires too much
hacking and loses the tune's character, you regretfully decide that
you can't use that tune for that dance.

I'd bet that the RSCDS wasn't nearly the first to convert slip jigs
to 6/8 time, and vice-versa. It's something that good dance musicians
just do, as needed or the whim strikes.

--
What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about?

"Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

Message 47599 · Marie Disiewicz · 15 Dec 2006 18:04:58 · Top

The spelling is Georgina Finlay - NO "D"

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Paterson" <alan.paterson@paranor.ch>
To: "SCD news and discussion" <strathspey@strathspey.org>
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: "Saint Andrews Links" by Georgina Findlay - Help please

> On 14/12/2006 23:54, George Meikle wrote:
>> Gabrielle,
>>
>> Thanks for the information about the jig but I was already well aware of
>> that dance and it is also in the database. It was the Strathspey which
>> was
>> causing the problem but I have now managed to confirm that it is
>> definitely
>> a 3x40S and not 8x40S as in DanceData.
>
> (Alan being pedantic)
>
> 1. Dancedata has NO dances as 8x32. What was stored for this dance was
> that it should be danced in a 4-couple set. (However many times it is
> danced is up to the dancers).
>
> 2. I have corrected this dance now to be a 3-couple set (dance it 3 times,
> 6 times or 9 times - up to you).
>
>
> Alan :-)
>
> --
> Alan Paterson
> Berne, Switzerland
>
>

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