strathspey Archive: Tartan choices for a kilt

Hello,

A friend asked me to post this for him. Please respond directly :) I'm just
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dan@lis.stanford.edu

thanks
ec
======his message starts here ==============

Re: Tartans from Mars ??

Can anyone think of an appropriate tartan for a third generation Lithuanian
Jewish, computer scientist from the San Francisco Bay Area?

I have become an avid Scottish Country dancer, and it is time to buy a kilt.

Dan Shapiro
dan@lis.stanford.edu

--

At 19:50 12/06/96, you wrote:

>Re: Tartans from Mars ??
>
>Can anyone think of an appropriate tartan for a third generation Lithuanian
>Jewish, computer scientist from the San Francisco Bay Area?
>
>I have become an avid Scottish Country dancer, and it is time to buy a kilt.
>
> Dan Shapiro
> dan@lis.stanford.edu
>
>
I suggest looking at the tartans that other people wear until you
see one you would really like to wear yourself. Ask the name of the tartan,
then work out a really improbable story about why you have a family
connection that lets you wear the tartan you like. Who is going to check
the story? Who cares? Who will ask, even? The better the story, the more
you may have to fish to get somebody to ask so you can tell it. Surely in
Lithuania at some time in the past there were Scottish mercenaries. Perhaps
that is a starting point for the story.

Bill Scott
St. John's, Newfoundland, Branch

Bill Scott, GeoScott Exploration Consultants Inc.
Memorial University of Newfoundland

I can recall the solution that one non-Scottish SC Dancer used some years
ago in Toronto: he selected the tartan of his teacher, which was intended
as a significant compliment (and was so received).

But I think Bill Scott's solution sounds more fun!

What do all the SCD folk in, say, Germany and Japan do?

Ian McHaffie
ianmch@inforamp.net

>
>Re: Tartans from Mars ??
>
>Can anyone think of an appropriate tartan for a third generation Lithuanian
>Jewish, computer scientist from the San Francisco Bay Area?
>
>I have become an avid Scottish Country dancer, and it is time to buy a kilt.
>
> Dan Shapiro
> dan@lis.stanford.edu

Ian McHaffie <ianmch@inforamp.net> writes:

> What do all the SCD folk in, say, Germany and Japan do?

I can only speak for myself, but what I did was look at the samples in the
kilt-maker's shop and pick one that I liked.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau ......................... lingnau@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de
FORTRAN... Then, as now, the language used by scientists with real problems.
--- Anon.

When you do pick a kilt from a kiltmakers samplels, I think you
should try to find all sorts of background information about the clan
this kilt belongs to.

And when wearing a crested-kiltpin one should be sure it is a
matching with te kilt

E.J. Dijkman

Well maybe if one doesn't have a clan connection they could look into a
District or Country Tartan...there are *many* and some can be ordered with
ease while others could be special woven. There is a weaver by the name of
Peter MacDonald, Address:Winnoch
Carrington Terrace,
Crieff,
Perthshire PH7 4DY
Scotland, UK

His fabric is superior to anything on the market.
And if you want him to create your own personal Tartan he can do that too!
If you want the best use his Tartan! I know I sound like a commerical but
it's true! He has won awards for his Tartan designs! He can also weave
Tartan using natural dyes, i.e., fruits and other veggie dyes! These make
for an expensive cloth but well worth the effort an expense.

Another thought is either a solid color kilt or a kilt in Harris Tweed.
Prince Albert often wore a kilt suit of Harris tweed.

Tom Mungall

Pick what you like and feel comfortable in.

Remember only one thing, that when some puffed-up,
self-important "Scot" asks you what right you have to
wear that particular tartan (and, fear not, sooner or later
one will), the correct answer is -
"The Scots sold it to me".

Jim Healy
Perth, Scotland

On 13 Jun 1996, The_Healys wrote:

> Pick what you like and feel comfortable in.
>
> Remember only one thing, that when some puffed-up,
> self-important "Scot" asks you what right you have to
> wear that particular tartan (and, fear not, sooner or later
> one will), the correct answer is -
> "The Scots sold it to me".

I agree, and am reminded also of a comment I heard a few years ago --
There are three ways to be Scottish: by birth, by marriage, or by
inclination.

Helen Welford

welford@umich.edu

As a Scot by inclination, married to someone who may be able to claim ancestry
from the Border but certainly not the Highland, I am suprised that no one has
recommended the Black Watch, which, when clan-kilt-wearing was outlawed, was worn
by Highland regiments who fought for the British in what is known in the US
as the French and Indian war (1750's). Among re-enactors who enjoy spending their
weekends outfitted correctly in the clothing and equipment from the period, it is
the only permissible kilt and seen quite alot.

Glad to know that "inclination" is welcome.

Greetings

At 15:09 96/06/12, Ellen C. Campbell wrote for Dan Shapiro:
[ ... ]
>
> Re: Tartans from Mars ??
>
> Can anyone think of an appropriate tartan for a third generation Lithuanian
> Jewish, computer scientist from the San Francisco Bay Area?
>
> I have become an avid Scottish Country dancer, and it is time to buy a kilt.
>

At 08:04 96/06/13, Evert Jan Dijkman wrote:

> When you do pick a kilt from a kiltmakers samples, I think you
> should try to find all sorts of background information about the clan
> this kilt belongs to.
>
> And when wearing a crested-kiltpin one should be sure it is a
> matching with te kilt
>

Since I come somewhat into the category Dan places himself in, I too was
"faced" with the choice of tartan.
I did what earlier correspondents suggest. Going to a local kiltmaker, I
spent a happy hour or so going through hundreds(?) of samples in swatch
books. I decided on three different designs, went away, thought about them,
made my choice, they ordered the material, eventually the kilt was ready.
The first occasion it saw the light of wear was at a Ball. I was MC for the
last third. During the preceding interval I changed behind stage out of my
dark trousers into the kilt. The effect on the throng when I appeared in my
new outfit was most amusing.

People ask me what tartan this is. I tell them. They ask if I am a
MacWhatever . I laugh and say no. If I know the person I might add "... and
I don't give a damn :-)".

Which explains my reaction to Evert's comment above: you do not have to do
anything atavistic or historic, *if it does not interest you* :-). It is
your taste, your preference, your being pleased which are important, not
some notion of clannish correctness :-).

I have only once found someone wearing the same tartan. I asked him. His
reasons were the same as mine - and he didn't give a damn either :-) - he
liked the colours and the pattern.

Most people look GRAND in a kilt, with the calf length socks and flashes,
so go for what you *like*.
Then there's a good chance ... you'll look even better <BIG smile>

All zest

*D

*David Hills [Opinions mostly mine own; facts are everybody's]
<dlh@radarsun.jpl.nasa.gov>
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena CA 91109-8099, U S A
Tel: 818/354-8741 Fax: 818/393-4879
J-P-L-------------------------------------------------------> * * * *

>On 13 Jun 1996, The_Healys wrote:
>
>> Pick what you like and feel comfortable in.
>>
>> Remember only one thing, that when some puffed-up,
>> self-important "Scot" asks you what right you have to
>> wear that particular tartan (and, fear not, sooner or later
>> one will), the correct answer is -
>> "The Scots sold it to me".
>
and Helen Welford replied:

>I agree, and am reminded also of a comment I heard a few years ago --
>There are three ways to be Scottish: by birth, by marriage, or by
>inclination.
>

There is a fourth; one can be Scottish by extraction. My dentist is named
McTavish.

ndahl@ozemail.com.au (Norman Dahl)

Dan Shapiro <dan@lis.stanford.edu> writes:

> Can anyone think of an appropriate tartan for a third generation >
Lithuanian Jewish, computer scientist from the San Francisco Bay > Area?

> I have become an avid Scottish Country dancer, and it is time to
> buy a kilt.

I have heard (though I haven't got round to doing the research to verify
this) that this business of clan tartans was invented by Scott (as in Sir
Walter) in the latter half of the 18th century when tartan was forbidden to
the Highlanders and became a fashion thing in London. So really it's an
English fad, and as such should be ignored :)

Having said that, the Scots seem to have been persuaded by the English
rewriting of their history and take it rather personally. As for myself, I
would say "wear what you like". I wear Brodie, mainly because my
girlfriend recommended it 'cos she likes it, and I looked at it and agreed.
I happen to have a good story about why I wear it - it's the local tartan
in Findhorn/Forres where I grew up - but that's just an excuse. But then,
I have a reason for favouring the clan tartans being a myth - does anyone
know of a Brockbank tartan (English Midlands root name)? Or Parker? Or
Grimes? Or Harrod? Well, I suppose Harrods will have created a tartan by
now...

Cheers,

Ian
Ian.Brockbank@edo.mts.dec.com
Edinburgh, Scotland

At 13.06.1996, Ian McHaffie wrote about the choice of tartans:

>What do all the SCD folk in, say, Germany and Japan do?
>

Choose the tartan of a Kilt offered to you by second hand sale! So was my
first and second. And don=B4t care about the Scott=B4s laments.

Stefan Barthel
-----------------------------------------------------
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Spardorfer Strasse 40a =20
D-91054 Erlangen ++49 / 9131 / 20 66 11=20

http://nuernberg.netsurf.de/User/barthel/index.html
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