strathspey Archive: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

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Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22451 · Alan Paterson · 9 Sep 2000 16:28:52 · Top

The recent long-winded exchange on another subject (No, I will not
repeat the name :-) has prompted me to make the following suggestion:

Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
programmes.

In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:

Waverley
M****'s W*****g

And, from others in my own group, I can add

Strip the Willow
Eightsome Reel

Anyone else willing to confess?

Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
reading this :-}

As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
"Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!

Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)

--
Alan Paterson
Berne, Switzerland
mailto:alan@paterson.ch

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22454 · cnordj · 9 Sep 2000 20:48:55 · Top

Hello all,
I agree on 3 of Alan Paterson's 4 nominations.
I will add: any dance with arches (rondels and such).
Alan, thanks for asking!
Cheers, Carol Johnson, Los Angeles area

On Sat, 09 Sep 2000, Alan Paterson <alanp@paranor.ch> wrote:
...
>Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
>is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...".
>In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
>
>Waverley
>M****'s W*****g
>>And, from others in my own group, I can add
>>Strip the Willow
>Eightsome Reel

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22458 · Marjorie McLaughlin · 9 Sep 2000 22:26:11 · Top

Oh, too good an opportunity to pass up! Here are mine:

Miss Gibson's Strathspey (only because of the tunes usually played)
The Garry Strathspey (ditto)
The White Heather Jig (oh dear, I appears that Mr. Cosh and I have
different musical tastes)

There's also my previously acknowledged prediliction for avoiding dances
with the Tournee due to my inability to dance the figure without an
excessive amount of mental effort and habit of dissolving into
hysterical laughter as I try my best to get it right. Not among my
finest social moments.

Marjorie McLaughlin
San Diego, CA

Alan Paterson wrote:
>
> The recent long-winded exchange on another subject (No, I will not
> repeat the name :-) has prompted me to make the following suggestion:
>
> Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
> is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
> especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
> programmes.
>
> In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
>
> Waverley
> M****'s W*****g
>
> And, from others in my own group, I can add
>
> Strip the Willow
> Eightsome Reel
>
> Anyone else willing to confess?
>
> Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
> reading this :-}
>
> As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
> tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
> you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
> "Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!
>
> Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)
>
> --
> Alan Paterson
> Berne, Switzerland
> mailto:alan@paterson.ch

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22459 · Thomas G. Mungall, III · 9 Sep 2000 22:28:58 · Top

One that I had rather sit out is the Petronella. Not that it is a bad dance
but that dancing it kills my legs! ;-)

Tom Mungall
Baton Rouge, La.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Paterson" <alanp@paranor.ch>
> Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
> is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
> especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
> programmes.

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22461 · Freeman/Pavey · 9 Sep 2000 23:00:29 · Top

Montgomeries Rant

A boring little dance.

Cole Pavey

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Message 22462 · Freeman/Pavey · 9 Sep 2000 23:05:43 · Top

Any time I see a program that starts with a two couple dance with a
pousette I groan and hide!

Susan Freeman,
Maberly

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22463 · Patricia Ruggiero · 9 Sep 2000 23:41:18 · Top

Generally, any 4-cpl longways whole set dance with the following predictable
(and boring) geometry: end couples do something while middles do something
else; two couples at either end work together; 1st cpl wend their way to the
bottom. No excitement in the story line....no tension.....pardon me while I
nod off.....

Pat

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22466 · Dianna Shipman · 10 Sep 2000 01:08:36 · Top

Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:

Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10 bars
(plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)

Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an English
dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English dance
I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even pace
without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)

Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music that
sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has strange
timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of bars one
time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to fit the
music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music or
some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may feel a
sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits but to
me they're just not fun.

Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad dash to
3rd place and go again)

Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's due to
the lack of horses:- )

and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs when my
feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).

I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is having
an effect.

Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
strokes for different folks".

Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the first
dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is often
left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy being
40 bars and with a circle.

But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there are
plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16 plus
dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can take a
trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my list of
dances I don't like :-)

Dianna

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Paterson" <alanp@paranor.ch>
To: "Strathspey" <strathspey@strathspey.de>
Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2000 7:28 AM
Subject: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> The recent long-winded exchange on another subject (No, I will not
> repeat the name :-) has prompted me to make the following suggestion:
>
> Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
> is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
> especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
> programmes.
>
> In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
>
> Waverley
> M****'s W*****g
>
> And, from others in my own group, I can add
>
> Strip the Willow
> Eightsome Reel
>
> Anyone else willing to confess?
>
> Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
> reading this :-}
>
> As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
> tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
> you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
> "Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!
>
> Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)
>
> --
> Alan Paterson
> Berne, Switzerland
> mailto:alan@paterson.ch
>
>
>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22468 · Carfuffle · 10 Sep 2000 01:35:20 · Top

Dances that I include in the "bathroom dance" category are Gay Gordons, or
just about any dances with waltz steps in them. I'm just not good at
waltzing. When I started SCD, I didn't dance At All. I learned lots of steps
and figures as I progressed but, there seems to be an assumption that
everyone knows how to waltz, so it isn't taught (after all it isn't strictly
a Scottish dance).

Nadene Hunter, Dansville, NY

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22469 · Frances Wilson · 10 Sep 2000 01:43:13 · Top

My, but aren't we all different?

My fuddyduddy list includes:
A Trip to Bavaria (mostly because of the music..)
Triumph
Postie's Jig
The Sailor and Pelorus Jack, just because I'm tired of them at the moment.

Frances

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Message 22472 · ron.mackey · 10 Sep 2000 02:47:41 · Top

> Montgomeries Rant
>
> A boring little dance.
>
> Cole Pavey

Now this is a dance I have enjoyed for 50 years. Recently It is not
done every week, perhaps twice in a years dancing so it stays quite
fresh.
Cheers, Ron :)

< 0 Ron Mackey,(Purveyor of Pat's Party Pieces)
'O> Mottingham,
/#\ London. UK.
l>
Ron.Mackey@btinternet.com

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22482 · Oberdan Otto · 10 Sep 2000 09:12:18 · Top

>Montgomeries Rant
>
>A boring little dance.
>
>Cole Pavey
>
>--
>TayHaven <tay@rideau.net>

Cole, you are brave indeed.

Alan, are you tabulating these responses???

Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22490 · mlbrown · 10 Sep 2000 16:06:39 · Top

Surprised not to see Seton's Ceilidh Band on the list, which several of our
group will avoid if at all possible - nothing to do with the dance, just the
recording which tends to be used. As far as "we" ,the "avoiders", are
concerned, it sounds more like the music you would hear at the seaside being
played by a brass band than Scottish dance music, and being so significantly
different there are a huge group of dancers who think that this music really
makes the dance! (I think I read something about different strokes?)

Malcolm

Malcolm & Helen Brown
Tir-Nan-Og - York (UK)

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22491 · eclyde · 10 Sep 2000 18:30:29 · Top

----- Original Message -----
From: mlbrown <mlbrown@supanet.com>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 8:13 AM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

>
> Surprised not to see Seton's Ceilidh Band on the list, which several of
our
> group will avoid if at all possible - nothing to do with the dance, just
the
> recording which tends to be used.

Which leads me back to an oft repeated hobby horse -- the importance of the
selection of the music -- not just "the right" music, but music that
inspires the dancers. And this can change, if a dance is repeated too
frequently. After the umpteenth time, almost any dance done to the same
recording becomes routine (live music is subtly different each time it is
performed). I like to vary the selection used in my programmes. And even
Seton's is on a number of different recordings/tapes/CDs, not all of them
starting with the same tune.

Eric

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22492 · S.M.D.Phillips · 10 Sep 2000 18:50:42 · Top

My list of sit out dances:
Lea Rig
Wind on Loch Fyne
Muirland Willie
Postie's Jig

I've been stunned by some of the comments about Mari's wedding; I prefer it
without twiddles myself, but that's just my preference. However, I do wish
that people wouldn't spin me round when we dance set and turn corners - you
see I get dizzy - and it's a horrible feeling

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ Stella Phillips
+ sphillips@sol.co.uk
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22494 · ferguson · 10 Sep 2000 20:01:16 · Top

Sit out because of the dance ??

In our area (Netherlands, Western Germany, Belgium) we seem to
have a great variety of dances: in 6 years of dancing my total
certainly exceeds 800. My usual reaction to any dance I have
done before is "Oh how nice; haven't danced that one for a long
time".

And even if the dance is not my preference: I rarely want to miss
the opportunity of inviting a partner and enjoying the company of all
the set.

Only two reasons to sit out: if I have something else important, or
pains.

Won't you join the dance?

Eric

Eric T. Ferguson, van Dormaalstraat 15, 5624 KH EINDHOVEN, Netherlands
tel: +31-40-243 2878 fax: +31-40-246 7036 e-mail: e.ferguson@antenna.nl

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22495 · JBSF1 · 10 Sep 2000 20:13:19 · Top

We need more Eric's!
Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many sitting out
for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)
Jill

Can't find a Partner

Message 22806 · e.ferguson · 19 Sep 2000 11:32:36 · Top

Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT

> Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)

Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
... "

He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "

So I had to sit out.

Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
befit the men.

Happy dancing with your partner,

Eric

Eric T. Ferguson, van Dormaalstraat 15, 5624 KH EINDHOVEN, Netherlands
tel: +31-40-243 2878 fax: +31-40-246 7036 e-mail: e.ferguson@antenna.nl

Can't find a Partner

Message 22809 · Alan Paterson · 19 Sep 2000 12:17:13 · Top

Eric Ferguson wrote:

> Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT
>
> > Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> > sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)
>
> Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
> paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
> that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
> you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
> ... "
>
> He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
>
> So I had to sit out.
>
> Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
> befit the men.

Indeed. I've had this happen to me as well. Odd!

Alan
--
Alan Paterson
Berne, Switzerland
mailto:alan@paterson.ch

Can't find a Partner

Message 22810 · Martin.Sheffield · 19 Sep 2000 12:32:03 · Top

Eric wrote:

>(...) I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
>you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
>... "
>
>He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
>
>So I had to sit out.

How rude !

You should have grabbed him by the hair, dragged him onto the floor, and said
"OK. YOU can be the women, then!" (wielding your claymore in the other hand).

:-)
Martin,
in Grenoble, France.

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/scd.htm
(dance groups, some new dances ...)

Can't find a Partner

Message 22815 · eclyde · 19 Sep 2000 17:43:21 · Top

Occasionally, to add "spice", when the sets have been formed
in my class, I tell the dancers to change places with their partners
and to dance from the opposite side. I won't say
that all of the men like the idea, but they accept it.
Perhaps because of this, we frequently have men dancing together
if there are no ladies sitting out.

Eric

----- Original Message -----
From: Alan Paterson <alanp@paranor.ch>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 4:16 AM
Subject: Re: Can't find a Partner (was: Top Sit-out List)

>
>
> Eric Ferguson wrote:
>
> > Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT
> >
> > > Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> > > sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)
> >
> > Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
> > paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
> > that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
> > you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
> > ... "
> >
> > He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
> >
> > So I had to sit out.
> >
> > Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
> > befit the men.
>
> Indeed. I've had this happen to me as well. Odd!
>
> Alan
> --
> Alan Paterson
> Berne, Switzerland
> mailto:alan@paterson.ch
>
>
>

Can't find a Partner

Message 22818 · Steve Wyrick · 19 Sep 2000 20:12:33 · Top

Is "barging in on a ladies' couple" considered impolite elsewhere? In this
area the norm seems to be that 2 men looking for partners can invite a pair
of ladies to split up, the premise being that the ladies would rather be
dancing with men than with each other, I guess! Men dancing with men are
fairly uncommon here; it is done when needed to fill a set if there aren't
enough ladies, although some guys are uncomfortable doing so (but we also
have a few guys who dance with each other by choice). -Steve

------Original Message------
From: "Eric Ferguson" <e.ferguson@antenna.nl>
To: strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de
Sent: September 19, 2000 7:32:29 AM GMT
Subject: Can't find a Partner (was: Top Sit-out List)

Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT

> Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)

Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
.... "

He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "

So I had to sit out.

Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
befit the men.

Steve Wyrick <sjwyrick@earthlink.net> -- Concord, California

Can't find a Partner

Message 22819 · Anselm Lingnau · 19 Sep 2000 20:25:13 · Top

Steve Wyrick <sjwyrick@earthlink.net> writes:

> Is "barging in on a ladies' couple" considered impolite elsewhere? In this
> area the norm seems to be that 2 men looking for partners can invite a pair
> of ladies to split up, the premise being that the ladies would rather be
> dancing with men than with each other, I guess!

Oops. At a social event, I'd say the ladies in question have obviously
asked each other to dance. I think it would be about as polite to
`invite' them to split up as it would be to invite a `mixed' couple to
split up. If the ladies would rather be dancing with men *they* can
offer to split up (or ask a man to begin with).

> Men dancing with men are
> fairly uncommon here; it is done when needed to fill a set if there aren't
> enough ladies, although some guys are uncomfortable doing so (but we also
> have a few guys who dance with each other by choice).

Gender proportions being what they are hereabouts, men dancing with men
at social functions are a very uncommon phenomenon. In my class there
are sometimes more men than women, and the way things work out are that
usually some man will volunteer to dance as a woman. If there are
all-female couples in the set and two men left over, sometimes the
ladies will offer to split up and sometimes I may ask them to do so (if
the dance seems easier to teach/understand without the added
complication of women dancing as men and men dancing as women --
teacher's privilege). And sometimes the left-over men are happy to dance
together or sit out. This goes for a class situation -- at a social
event I think the couples should be left as they are.

Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau ......................... lingnau@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de
TODAY'S TIP FOR WRITERS: When writing a business report, avoid big words and
jargon; try to use everyday language. WRONG: "We will prioritize the
infrastructure paradigm matrices." RIGHT: "We are fixin' to prioritize the
infrastructure paradigm matrices." -- Dave Barry

Can't find a Partner

Message 22821 · Coletta Busse · 19 Sep 2000 21:26:43 · Top

Being a lady that often dances with other ladies I'd like to put my 2 cents
into what, at this point appears to be a man dominated discussion (not that
I haven't enjoyed the thread :-)
Consideration is always the first and best rule of thumb. I do consider it
barging if it is presumed that "Of COURSE these ladies would rather dance
with MEN" I would far rather dance with a woman who dances well and is good
company than a man, simply because he is a man. It is okay to ask if we are
willing to split up, but it is NOT okay to take offence or make comments if
we refuse. There have been functions here where there were two men left
over, and they appeared unwilling to dance with each other. The MC requested
if there were any two lady couples that would be will to do these men the
honor of splitting up and dancing with them. There is usually no dearth of
volunteers.
However two man couples shouldn't be an issue anymore than a two lady
couple, they are just less common. We just have to be sympathetic to the
poor blokes that feeled threatened, We're just dancing after all!
cheers,
Coletta Busse
Northern California
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Can't find a Partner

Message 22822 · Oberdan Otto · 19 Sep 2000 21:49:11 · Top

>Is "barging in on a ladies' couple" considered impolite elsewhere?

Yes.

>In this area the norm seems to be that 2 men looking for partners
>can invite a pair of ladies to split up, the premise being that the
>ladies would rather be dancing with men than with each other, I
>guess!

It is never polite to presume, especially since the two ladies in
question DID ask each other to dance. Moreover, the 2 men in question
should be agreeable to dancing with each other (i.e. they should ask
each other to dance) and take a place in a set before considering
swapping partners with a female couple.

I find, however, that once couples have formed, impromptu partner
swapping is common when the four people know each other well. It is
not necessarily that they would rather dance with the opposite
gender: they might simply prefer to dance on their "normal" side.

Even so, the two ladies in question may have actively sought each
other out and really want to partner each other. I know of a
particular situation where two energetic young ladies like to do a
particular dance together, changing sides on every repetition, much
to the puzzlement of the other couples (weren't you just dancing as a
lady?).

Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Can't find a Partner

Message 22824 · Marjorie McLaughlin · 20 Sep 2000 00:34:50 · Top

Ah, but for the presence of a strict arbiter of taste and etiquette!
Were we living in the early 19th century, Mr. Thomas Wilson would ensure
that we knew exactly what he thought we should do.

>From his 1816 Companion to the Ballroom:

"Two Ladies, or two Gentlemen, cannot dance together, without permission
of the Master of Ceremonies; nor can permission be given while there are
an equal number of Ladies and Gentlemen. In the absence of Gentlemen,
when Ladies are premitted to form couples, and in the absence of Ladies,
when it occurs that Gentlemen are permitted to form couples, they must
always stand at the bottom of the set."

One does wonder if the assembly conformed to Mr. Wilson's strict
requirements . . .

Marjorie McLaughlin
San Diego, CA

Two Gentlemen Dancing together

Message 22846 · Jodie Hebert · 20 Sep 2000 18:20:25 · Top

Marjorie,
I'm sure the rule you quote was as strictly observed as the RSCDS
rule that we must all wait for the first 8 bars of music and the MC's
announcement before we form sets for the next dance! Some
things don't change...
Cheers, Jodie

> >From his 1816 Companion to the Ballroom:
> "Two Ladies, or two Gentlemen, cannot dance together, without
> permission of the Master of Ceremonies; nor can permission be given
> while there are an equal number of Ladies and Gentlemen. In the
> absence of Gentlemen, when Ladies are premitted to form couples, and
> in the absence of Ladies, when it occurs that Gentlemen are permitted
> to form couples, they must always stand at the bottom of the set."
>
> One does wonder if the assembly conformed to Mr. Wilson's strict
> requirements . . .
>
> Marjorie McLaughlin
> San Diego, CA

Jodie Parker-Hebert
McLennan Library, Collections Dept.
McGill University, Montreal, PQ Canada
Voice: 514-398-4782 FAX: 514-398-7184

Two Gentlemen Dancing together

Message 22848 · eclyde · 20 Sep 2000 19:23:52 · Top

Hi Jodie:
According to what I have read in various sources, these directors/
masters of ceremonies were often martinets of the "you had better
behave or else" school, and you could get banned from the ballroom
if you didn't follow the comprehensive/complicated set of rules.
Eric

----- Original Message -----
From: Jodie Hebert <Hebert@library.mcgill.ca>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2000 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: Two Gentlemen Dancing together

> Marjorie,
> I'm sure the rule you quote was as strictly observed as the RSCDS
> rule that we must all wait for the first 8 bars of music and the MC's
> announcement before we form sets for the next dance! Some
> things don't change...
> Cheers, Jodie
>
> > >From his 1816 Companion to the Ballroom:
> > "Two Ladies, or two Gentlemen, cannot dance together, without
> > permission of the Master of Ceremonies; nor can permission be given
> > while there are an equal number of Ladies and Gentlemen. In the
> > absence of Gentlemen, when Ladies are premitted to form couples, and
> > in the absence of Ladies, when it occurs that Gentlemen are permitted
> > to form couples, they must always stand at the bottom of the set."
> >
> > One does wonder if the assembly conformed to Mr. Wilson's strict
> > requirements . . .
> >
> > Marjorie McLaughlin
> > San Diego, CA
>
> Jodie Parker-Hebert
> McLennan Library, Collections Dept.
> McGill University, Montreal, PQ Canada
> Voice: 514-398-4782 FAX: 514-398-7184
>
> --
> "Jodie Hebert" <Hebert@library.mcgill.ca>
>

Can't find a Partner

Message 22825 · Tim Harrison · 20 Sep 2000 01:45:27 · Top

I do the same with my teen class. They look at it as a fun challenge.

Actually, this semester I will have boys dancing with boys on a regular
basis. I've got more boys than girls in my class!

-- Tim Harrison
-- Austin, Texas

At 08:42 AM 9/19/00, you wrote:
>Occasionally, to add "spice", when the sets have been formed
>in my class, I tell the dancers to change places with their partners
>and to dance from the opposite side. I won't say
>that all of the men like the idea, but they accept it.
>Perhaps because of this, we frequently have men dancing together
>if there are no ladies sitting out.
>
>Eric
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Alan Paterson <alanp@paranor.ch>
>To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
>Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 4:16 AM
>Subject: Re: Can't find a Partner (was: Top Sit-out List)
>
>
> >
> >
> > Eric Ferguson wrote:
> >
> > > Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT
> > >
> > > > Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> > > > sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)
> > >
> > > Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
> > > paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
> > > that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
> > > you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
> > > ... "
> > >
> > > He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
> > >
> > > So I had to sit out.
> > >
> > > Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
> > > befit the men.
> >
> > Indeed. I've had this happen to me as well. Odd!
> >
> > Alan
> > --
> > Alan Paterson
> > Berne, Switzerland
> > mailto:alan@paterson.ch

Can't find a Partner

Message 22827 · Coletta Busse · 20 Sep 2000 02:17:29 · Top

In the Livermore Children's class Sheena refers to the Talls and the Smalls.
The Talls being what we would normally refer to as the Men's side. That way
there is no gender bias and since 9 year old boys might be shorter than a 9
year old girl... It keeps all kinds of issues from arising. And the dancing
is more fun to watch than a basket full of puppies.
Coletta
Northern California
_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at
http://profiles.msn.com.

Can't find a Partner

Message 22834 · Miriam L. Mueller · 20 Sep 2000 04:57:51 · Top

A propos Marjorie McLaughlin's report that Wilson put same-sex couples at
the foot of the set -

On a trip of SCDers, I believe it was to New Zealand, no one seemed to
mind same-sex couples, but when two women were at the head of the set
lines, the male closest to the top assumed the responsibility of counting
off the sets. Surprised some of us women, I'll tell you.
Miriam Mueller, San Francisco

Can't find a Partner

Message 22862 · Tim Harrison · 21 Sep 2000 02:53:09 · Top

Coletta,

What a great idea! I'm going start using Talls and Smalls in my "teen" class. I just started permitting "teens" under 13 to attend my class. So, I've got greater height disparity in the class now.

-- Tim Harrison
-- Austin, Texas

At 05:16 PM 9/19/00, you wrote:
>In the Livermore Children's class Sheena refers to the Talls and the Smalls. The Talls being what we would normally refer to as the Men's side. That way there is no gender bias and since 9 year old boys might be shorter than a 9 year old girl... It keeps all kinds of issues from arising. And the dancing is more fun to watch than a basket full of puppies.
>Coletta
>Northern California
>_________________________________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.
>
>Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.
>
>
>--
>"Coletta Busse" <cmbusse@hotmail.com>
>

Can't find a Partner

Message 22869 · Sequoia781 · 21 Sep 2000 07:18:41 · Top

> Even so, the two ladies in question may have actively sought each
> other out and really want to partner each other. I know of a
> particular situation where two energetic young ladies like to do a
> particular dance together, changing sides on every repetition, much
> to the puzzlement of the other couples (weren't you just dancing as a
> lady?).

Hi Oberdan,

Hmmmm.....:-) I think I remember doing just that myself a number of times at
SGV dances :-) Keeps people on their toes.

Monica

Can't find a Partner

Message 22877 · James R. Ferguson · 21 Sep 2000 21:13:33 · Top

While at the Cincinnati (Ohio) workshop one year, they needed one more
couple to finish out a set. My husband volunteered to dance if he could
find a partner. A young fellow with very long hair, neatly pulled back in a
ponytail agreed to dance. Pulling the band from his hair and shaking it
loose as they joined the set, he said, "I'll be the lady." No confusion in
the set, but plenty of good humor!
Donna

Eric Ferguson wrote:

> Jill wrote on Sun, 10 Sep 2000 12:12:42 EDT
>
> > Third reason to sit out......Can't find a partner!!!! (so many
> > sitting out for reasons 4, 5, 6, etc.)
>
> Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
> paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
> that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
> you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
> ... "
>
> He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
>
> So I had to sit out.
>
> Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
> befit the men.
>
> Happy dancing with your partner,
>
> Eric
>
> Eric T. Ferguson, van Dormaalstraat 15, 5624 KH EINDHOVEN, Netherlands
> tel: +31-40-243 2878 fax: +31-40-246 7036 e-mail: e.ferguson@antenna.nl

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22833 · e.ferguson · 20 Sep 2000 04:16:43 · Top

Eric Clyde wrote on Tue, 19 Sep 2000 09:42:54 -0400
(was subject: Re: Can't find a Partner (was: Top Sit-out List)

> Occasionally, to add "spice", when the sets have been formed
> in my class, I tell the dancers to change places with their partners
> and to dance from the opposite side. I won't say
> that all of the men like the idea, but they accept it.
> Perhaps because of this, we frequently have men dancing together
> if there are no ladies sitting out.

I would love to join that class. In most figures, dancing on the ladies'
side mainly requires thinking hard about where you should be, and
remembering to pass in front, but there are a number of figures
(Promenade, Knot, Allemande, Tournee, Pass under arm in several forms;
any others?) where M and L roles are quite different. It would be useful
for me to "get the feel" of the lady's part, and so to become a better
partner when leading in these figures. In addition, it's just fun to
change over. I envy the ladies who can so often switch sides.

The problem is of course that inexperienced dancers in the set can get
confused if they not only have Ls dancing as M, but also M dancing as Ls.
How do classes solve that? Does the system of wearing a ribbon or sash to
show "gender" help?

Happy switching,

Eric Ferguson
Eric T. Ferguson, van Dormaalstraat 15, 5624 KH EINDHOVEN, Netherlands
tel: +31-40-243 2878 fax: +31-40-246 7036 e-mail: e.ferguson@antenna.nl

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22838 · Oberdan Otto · 20 Sep 2000 11:14:46 · Top

> > Occasionally, to add "spice", when the sets have been formed
> > in my class, I tell the dancers to change places with their partners
> > and to dance from the opposite side. I won't say
> > that all of the men like the idea, but they accept it.
> > Perhaps because of this, we frequently have men dancing together
> > if there are no ladies sitting out.
>
>I would love to join that class...

Once when I was teaching a dance at a workshop, we were one lady
short in one set on the final dance-through because someone had to
leave early. So yours truly filled in. Something I hadn't realized
when teaching the dance is that there was a really fun little move
that the ladies got to do that the men didn't.

I was really happy that I got to do the ladies part. I think there
are a lot of other fun little things the ladies do because of the
slight gender asymmetry in SCD.

In Modern Ballroom dancing the asymmetry is very strong. For example,
in one movement called a "Rudolph Rondee", the woman kicks her right
leg slightly up, while the man (in a closed Ballroom hold) steps into
her with the right hip and a momentary sharp right body twist. This
sends the lady's leg back and behind in a aerial Rondee action.
Sometimes if I am a little too energetic, Vanessa's leg goes flying
and her eyes get very big as does her smile. So she gets to do this
really fun move for which I provide the energy. That is a bit of fun
that I am unlikely to experience because there is no such move in
which the lady returns the favor--in Modern Ballroom, the man is
showing off the lady and not vice-versa.

But in SCD we have a near symmetry which makes it fairly easy to
reverse roles. It appears however, that the slight gender asymmetry
introduces extra little fun things that the ladies get to do.

So guys, if you are up for a little extra fun, don't be too reluctant
the dance the ladies' part--just don't try to lead!

Cheers, Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22847 · eclyde · 20 Sep 2000 19:05:48 · Top

This is an advanced class, so there are no inexperienced dancers.
But I won't claim that there are never any sex changes during the dance!

Eric

----- Original Message -----
From: Eric Ferguson <e.ferguson@antenna.nl>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 8:16 PM
Subject: Men dancing on the other side.
>
> The problem is of course that inexperienced dancers in the set can get
> confused if they not only have Ls dancing as M, but also M dancing as Ls.
> How do classes solve that? Does the system of wearing a ribbon or sash to
> show "gender" help?
>
> Happy switching,
>
> Eric Ferguson
> Eric T. Ferguson, van Dormaalstraat 15, 5624 KH EINDHOVEN, Netherlands
> tel: +31-40-243 2878 fax: +31-40-246 7036 e-mail: e.ferguson@antenna.nl
>
>

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22867 · Jim & Marla · 21 Sep 2000 04:35:12 · Top

Our group has only three men at the best of times, a few of us women usually
dance as men and we wear sashes. Often when we dance in public we wear our
kilts and black stockings instead of our usual dresses. Works for us.
Marla

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22876 · Martin.Sheffield · 21 Sep 2000 21:03:58 · Top

At 17:33 20/09/00 -0700, you wrote:
> a few of us women usually
>dance as men and we wear sashes.

Since when have men worn sashes?
I thought that was part of the ladies' attire.
That's what distinguishes the ladies hereabouts, in any case -- even if the
"sash" is sometimes no more than a tartan ribbon.

I find it most confusing when I find, in other places, that some ladies
wear sashes because they are ladies, and others wear them because they are
"men". Not to speak of the men who remain undecorated because they are men,
while others are decorated because they are not.
Martin,
in Grenoble, France.

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/scd.htm
(dance groups, some new dances ...)

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22878 · Alan Paterson · 21 Sep 2000 21:26:10 · Top

M Sheffield wrote:

> At 17:33 20/09/00 -0700, you wrote:
> > a few of us women usually
> >dance as men and we wear sashes.
>
> Since when have men worn sashes?
> I thought that was part of the ladies' attire.
> That's what distinguishes the ladies hereabouts, in any case -- even if the
> "sash" is sometimes no more than a tartan ribbon.
>
> I find it most confusing when I find, in other places, that some ladies
> wear sashes because they are ladies, and others wear them because they are
> "men". Not to speak of the men who remain undecorated because they are men,
> while others are decorated because they are not.

I know exactly what you mean, Martin. The times I have visited your group have
always been a great source of confusion for me <vbg>

Alan

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22901 · Dianna Shipman · 23 Sep 2000 19:08:22 · Top

Here the men "borrow" the women's sashes on the rare occasions when the men
outnumber the women. However, I agree that at balls when the women are
wearing sashes as part of their outfit and there is nothing done to
distinguish which women are dancing on the men's side that it can be very
confusing. I have never seen any method at a ball to distinguish which
women are dancing on the men's side.
Dianna

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1302 Waugh Drive
Houston, TX 77019-3908
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "M Sheffield" <martin.sheffield@wanadoo.fr>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2000 2:44 AM
Subject: Re: Men dancing on the other side

> At 17:33 20/09/00 -0700, you wrote:
> > a few of us women usually
> >dance as men and we wear sashes.
>
> Since when have men worn sashes?
> I thought that was part of the ladies' attire.
> That's what distinguishes the ladies hereabouts, in any case -- even if
the
> "sash" is sometimes no more than a tartan ribbon.
>
> I find it most confusing when I find, in other places, that some ladies
> wear sashes because they are ladies, and others wear them because they are
> "men". Not to speak of the men who remain undecorated because they are
men,
> while others are decorated because they are not.
> Martin,
> in Grenoble, France.
>
> http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/scd.htm
> (dance groups, some new dances ...)
>
> --
> M Sheffield <martin.sheffield@wanadoo.fr>
>
>

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22903 · Thomas G. Mungall, III · 23 Sep 2000 19:58:29 · Top

Dianna and All, About three or four years ago there was a thread on
Strathspey-List entitled "Gender Benders" and was quite funny and
interesting. It covered in detail all the different ways to denote men
dancing as women and women dancing as men. One of the funniest to me was the
women who wore fake mustaches!

All the best!

Tom
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dianna Shipman" <diannashipman@worldnet.att.net>

> Here the men "borrow" the women's sashes on the rare occasions when the
men
> outnumber the women. However, I agree that at balls when the women are
> wearing sashes as part of their outfit and there is nothing done to
> distinguish which women are dancing on the men's side that it can be very
> confusing. I have never seen any method at a ball to distinguish which
> women are dancing on the men's side.
> Dianna

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22905 · S.M. Gent · 23 Sep 2000 20:15:28 · Top

Does anyone know (or have words to) the poem about the two-sex country
dancer? I know I have somewhere but I can't find them - it would fit in
perfectly to this discussion.

Se=F3naid

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22906 · CLubitz · 23 Sep 2000 21:58:00 · Top

we have a permanently-knotted tartan necktie that we hang around a woman's
neck when she is a "man".

cece

******************************************************
* Cecil Lubitz
* 85 Mann Blvd
* Clifton Park, NY 12065
* Phone (home) 518-383-6580 (fax) 518-371-7125
* Clubitz@aol.com
******************************************************

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22907 · CLubitz · 23 Sep 2000 22:09:18 · Top

In a message dated 9/23/00 12:16:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
smg08@students.stir.ac.uk writes:

<< Does anyone know (or have words to) the poem about the two-sex country
dancer? >>

there once was a young scottish dancer,
for whose sexual orientation noone could answer.
tho' some would deride,
on could dance either side,
and on wore both a skirt and some pants (er).

anonymous

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22911 · ron.mackey · 24 Sep 2000 01:06:10 · Top


Hi, Seonaid
The piece which starts with this line is from No.1 Book 1
called 'Some of Pat's Party Pieces'. They can still be obtained at
very reasonable cost. Pat has said that I can send these out any
time but I've been neglecting them of late.

THE LADIES MAN

I'm a two-sex Scottish Dancer
And may seem rather dim,
But I never spend one evening
As a full-time her or him.

I change my sex from dance to dance
My corners always alter,
It's really not surprising if
Occasionally I falter.

The old and simple dances
I can manage very nicely,
And I can learn a new dance
And do it most precisely.

But when it comes to next week
I don't know if I can,
For I learnt it as a woman
And dance it as a man.

And so you men who have the luck
To always stay the same,
When female gentlemen go wrong
Be sparing with your blame.

I'll add a postscript to this tale
- One comfort I have got -
When both the women change their sex
It doesn't show a lot!!.
_________________
Cheers, Ron :)

< 0 Ron Mackey,(Purveyor of Pat's Party Pieces)
'O> Mottingham,
/#\ London. UK.
l>
Ron.Mackey@btinternet.com

Men dancing on the other side

Message 22908 · Richard L. Walker · 23 Sep 2000 22:16:10 · Top

Here tis:

The Two-sex Scottish Dancer
Patricia Batt

I'm a two sex Scottish Dancer and may seem rather dim,
But I never spend one evening as a full time her or him,
I change my sex from dance to dance, my corners always alter
It's really not surprising I occasionally falter.
The old and simple dances I can manage very nicely
And I can learn a new dance and do it most precisely,
But when it comes to next week I don't know if I can
For I learnt it as a woman and dance it as a man.
And so you men who have the luck to always stay the same
When female gentlemen go wrong be sparing with your blame.
I'll add a postscript to this tale - one comfort I have got
When both the women change their sex it doesn't show a lot!

Patricia Batt

This is taken from a series of small booklets, "Pat's Party Pieces"
published in aid of the North London hospice. Copies of Pat's Party Pieces
are available from:

50 Fitzjohn Avenue
Barnet
Herts
EN5 2HW

"Richard L Walker"<rlwalker@granis.net>
Pensacola, FL 32504-7726 USA

-----Original Message-----
From: Seonaid Mairi Gent [mailto:smg08@students.stir.ac.uk]
Does anyone know (or have words to) the poem about the two-sex country
dancer? I know I have somewhere but I can't find them - it would fit in
perfectly to this discussion.

Gender Benders (was Men dancing on the other side)

Message 22840 · Oberdan Otto · 20 Sep 2000 11:25:05 · Top

>The problem is of course that inexperienced dancers in the set can get
>confused if they not only have Ls dancing as M, but also M dancing as Ls.
>How do classes solve that? Does the system of wearing a ribbon or sash to
>show "gender" help?

I think it would be interesting to hear what current subscribers have
to say on this subject. However, there was a fairly lengthy thread a
couple of years back under the subject "gender benders", referring to
devices (sashes, buttons, hats, paste-on-mustaches...) to help people
identify the gender roles in a set when they do not correspond to the
actual genders. So check out the archive if you are interested in
what was said then.

Cheers, Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Can't find a Partner

Message 22835 · Angus Henry · 20 Sep 2000 07:12:12 · Top

Eric Ferguson wrote:
>
>Once I wanted to dance, but all the available ladies had already
>paired off, and as it is impolite to barge in on a ladies' couple
>that has formed, I invited one of the men who was still sitting "will
>you join me for this dance? I can take the ladies' place if you like
>... "
>
>He looked aghast ... "but we don't do that here .!! "
>
>So I had to sit out.
>
>Apparently some feel that what befits the ladies does not always
>befit the men.
>
>Happy dancing with your partner,

That is a shame. This situation has arisen twice for me in recent
times, but both times with a perfectly successful outcome; once in NZ
when the call for a final couple to complete the last set in a social
dance could only produce another man and myself - we just walked to
the side of the set nearest to where we were coming from and danced
as well and happily as anyone else; the second time at St Andrews
this year, when in class, being taken through a dance with the
Tournee in it, another man and myself found ourselves left to 'pair
off' - I volunteered to take the distaff role as the Tournee did not
present problems to me, and again the lesson and the dance went off
perfectly well. (In fact, some members of the class later confided
that they did not think the teacher had even noticed the two men
doing a perfect Tournee towards the back of the room . . . .)
:-)

No problems

Angus
--

* * * * * * * * * * * * *
Angus & Puka Henry:- 4 Eagle Court, WULAGI, NT 0812, AUSTRALIA
PHONE: (International) + 61 (0)8 8927 9203
FAX: as phone, but phone FIRST to arrange for it to be switched on!
Website: <http://www.octa4.net.au/ahenry/>

Can't find a Partner

Message 22842 · Pia Walker · 20 Sep 2000 12:36:06 · Top

I think that happens in Scotland too

Re counting - I wish that couples would stay together, on their own sides in
a line, during counting, so as not to cause confusion - that way we could
spend more time dancing and less time re-counting.

Pia
----- Original Message -----
From: Miriam L. Mueller <mimimueller@juno.com>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2000 1:42 AM
Subject: Re: Can't find a Partner (was: Top Sit-out List)

> A propos Marjorie McLaughlin's report that Wilson put same-sex couples at
> the foot of the set -
>
> On a trip of SCDers, I believe it was to New Zealand, no one seemed to
> mind same-sex couples, but when two women were at the head of the set
> lines, the male closest to the top assumed the responsibility of counting
> off the sets. Surprised some of us women, I'll tell you.
> Miriam Mueller, San Francisco
>
> --
> "Miriam L. Mueller" <mimimueller@juno.com>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22645 · Martin.Sheffield · 13 Sep 2000 22:45:08 · Top

Carol wrote:
>
>I will add: any dance with arches (rondels and such).

Agree abput rondels (a much-ado-about-nothing figure) but arches in other
dances (and which, unlike rondel, fit the music) are usually fun dances --
Postie's comes to mind. Not so keen on too much repetition though, as in
Jessie's hornpipe, the music for which deserves a much more interesting dance.

Funny how the same titles come up in both favorite and sit-out lists.

One of my unfavorites is Red House.
Others are the 8x32 speys where you spend more time standing waiting for
you turn than actually participating -- Dalkieth's comes to mind.

I wonder if any of you can remember an LP where Dalkieth's spey started off
pleasantly enough, firm rythm, clear sound, but ended sounding as if 3/4 of
the band had gone to sleep and the pianist was about to fall off his stool.
That was enough to put anyone off strathspeys for a lifetime.
Martin,
in Grenoble, France.

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/scd.htm
(dance groups, some new dances ...)

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22646 · Doug Mills · 14 Sep 2000 01:07:48 · Top

M Sheffield wrote:

> ....
> One of my unfavorites is Red House.
> Others are the 8x32 speys where you spend more time standing waiting for
> you turn than actually participating -- Dalkieth's comes to mind.
>

Zoots Alors! Someone who dosn't like Red House!

I'm gob smacked, my fingers tremble with rage on my keyboard and my screen is now
covered in spittle.

You just leave poor Red House alone, it's my favourite!

I guess this thread goes to prove that what appeals to one dancer sends another
running from the hall in terror. I think we could confidently take Dianna's "Most
Popular Dance List" and call it "Most Detested Dance List" and between them we
would probably satisfy most dancers.

Just so long as Red House and The Braes of Breadalbane only appear at the top of
the most popular list.

Cheers

Doug Mills

ps - Martin, you must be feeling pretty smug about the Euro Fuel crisis?

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22649 · Richard L. Walker · 14 Sep 2000 01:50:25 · Top

Big time.

"Richard L Walker"<rlwalker@granis.net>
Pensacola, FL 32504-7726 USA

-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Mills [mailto:radagast@cyberxpress.co.nz]
...I guess this thread goes to prove that what appeals to one dancer sends
another
running from the hall in terror...

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22674 · Susan McKinnell · 14 Sep 2000 18:05:37 · Top

I find this whole topic fascinating. I don't have unfavorite dances so much as
unfavorite figures, e.g. I really don't like quicktime circles or promenades.
Anyone else have "unfavorite" figures?
Just to end on a positive note, my favorite dances (other than a couple I've
written) are Mairi's Wedding, Irish Rover, and Tomalena.
Sue
--
Susan McKinnell suem@lucent.com 630-979-5313 630-224-5488(fax)
"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable
one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore,
all progress depends on the unreasonable man." -George Bernard Shaw

nothing to do with: Top Sit-out List

Message 22666 · Martin.Sheffield · 14 Sep 2000 12:29:45 · Top

At 09:10 14/09/00 +1200, you wrote:
Doug Mills wrote:
>
>ps - Martin, you must be feeling pretty smug about the Euro Fuel crisis?
>

"smug" is not quite the word.
Disgusted with a socialist government with green elements that can give way
so quickly to hostage taking (it was not a strike; the whole country was
taken hostage by the blocade) -- with disastrous consequences. Now the
whole of Europe is clamouring for cheaper fuel, at a time when our ever
increasing wealth is already being spent on ever-increasing consumption of
energy, largely for non-productive activities.

The whole point of the tax on fuel was to discourage us from using more
imported petroleum than the country can afford -- with the more recently
added aim of reducing urban pollution. Considering the way that many
drivers waste the fuel they buy, it is quite clear to me that the price is
far too low (in any case, it is lower than it was 15 years ago). Have you
never seen anyone getting his car out to post a letter or buy a loaf of
bread? Have you ever counted the lorries on the roads carrying bottles of
water (for example) from one country to another, frequently a mutual
exchange that benfits none but the transporters and oil giants?

Alas, the general attitude is "chacun pour soi" -- i don't care what
happens to the rest of society, as long as I can stay behind the wheel with
my right foot down.
Few people realize just what the real costs of motor vehicle use amount to.

Vive la bicyclette !
And long life to those that use a cycle to go dancing !

Martin,
in Grenoble, France.

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/scots.in.france/scd.htm
(dance groups, some new dances ...)

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Message 22471 · ron.mackey · 10 Sep 2000 02:47:39 · Top

>
> In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
>
> Waverley
> M****'s W*****g
>
> And, from others in my own group, I can add
>
> Strip the Willow
> Eightsome Reel
>
> Anyone else willing to confess?
>
> Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
> reading this :-}
>
> As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
> tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
> you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
> "Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!
>
> Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)
I'm with you Alan.

How about :-
My Heather Hills (with salutations to the deviser).
Irish Rover
Cheers, Ron :)

< 0 Ron Mackey,(Purveyor of Pat's Party Pieces)
'O> Mottingham,
/#\ London. UK.
l>
Ron.Mackey@btinternet.com

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Message 22496 · Todd Pierce · 10 Sep 2000 21:02:54 · Top

Any four-couple eight-times through Strathspey sends me out of the room
(particularly if it is one w/out any interesting figures in it - Miss
Ogilvie's Fancy comes to mind as one that goes on and on and on and on with
little excitement...as a friend of mine said, you can grow old get married
and have kids during that dance).

I'm also not wild about any of the 5 couple dances done with four couples in
a square and one on the middle. For some reason they irk me.

Unlike others though these dances mentioned before will certainly get me
onto the floor, and for encores too -
Waverley
Mairi's Wedding
Strip the Willow
Eightsome Reel
Montgomeries Rant
White Heather Jig

Todd Pierce
Asheville, NC

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Message 22498 · The_Healys · 10 Sep 2000 21:37:02 · Top

Greetings

Eric mentions greeting dances as old friends. The problem
comes when you are fortunate enough to be somewhere to
dance two or three times a week. There was a spell when
three particular dances were on EVERY programme. You will
not find me on the floor for:

Seton's Ceilidh Band
The Irish Rover and
Shiftin' Bobbins

Apart from those, Marjorie and I obviously have very
similar tastes in timing bar visits :)

Jim Healy
Perth, Scotland

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Message 22500 · Miriam L. Mueller · 10 Sep 2000 23:06:35 · Top

I don't sit out easy two-couple strathspeys, but my set may have to wake
me up, as lack of interesting activity sets me wool-gathering.
Miriam Mueller
SF

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Message 22504 · JANGSTROM · 11 Sep 2000 00:50:24 · Top

How about the endless Argyll Strathspey and the "on every program" Mrs.
Stewart's Jig to ad to the list?
Jane

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Message 22505 · Michael Hanson · 11 Sep 2000 00:51:54 · Top

Sit out -

Any 2 couple around the room (e.g. couple facing couple) fast time dance.
(These seem to show up often on general public Introduction to SCD
nights, probably because the figures are easy, but they are reel killers
to legs, etc.)

Posties Jig (Done it too much.)

---
But my all time fav's list includes

St. Andrews Fair (great music)
and
Mairi's Wedding

---

The matter of Waltz is another problem at Introduction to SCD
events. At least around here it often seems to appear (say in Waltz
Country Dance), but I suspect it turns a lot of people off from SC
dancing. Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or so
have learned to waltz? To take your average Joe off the street, put
a woman in his arms, and tell him to lead something he hasn't got a
clue about - not conducive to an enjoyable evening (or to his coming
back).
Don't get me wrong here, I love Waltz country dance, its just not
something you should throw at people who may not know how to waltz.

Michael
Seattle, USA
(Not over 50, but learned to waltz anyway.)

In article <77.9591b31.26ec06e8@aol.com>, Carfuffle@aol.com wrote:
>Dances that I include in the "bathroom dance" category are Gay Gordons, or
>just about any dances with waltz steps in them. I'm just not good at
>waltzing. When I started SCD, I didn't dance At All. I learned lots of steps
>and figures as I progressed but, there seems to be an assumption that
>everyone knows how to waltz, so it isn't taught (after all it isn't strictly
>a Scottish dance).
>
>Nadene Hunter, Dansville, NY
>
>--
>Carfuffle@aol.com
>
>

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Message 22506 · RuddBaron · 11 Sep 2000 00:55:58 · Top

In a message dated Sun, 10 Sep 2000 4:52:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, michaelh@scn.org (Michael Hanson) writes:

Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or so
have learned to waltz

--- At a cotillion or the like.

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Message 22507 · Elainerb · 11 Sep 2000 01:00:21 · Top

In a message dated 9/10/00 4:56:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
RuddBaron@aol.com writes:

<< n a message dated Sun, 10 Sep 2000 4:52:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
michaelh@scn.org (Michael Hanson) writes:

Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or so
have learned to waltz?????

---------How about a dance workshop ????????

Elaine

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Message 22508 · Elainerb · 11 Sep 2000 01:25:25 · Top

Isn't it great that someones 'top sit out dance' is one of my
favourites...... okay I have a 50% chance of getting the tournee right....but
I still Love the Argyll Strathspey. When it works it brilliant and when it
doesn't, it's a great 24 bars with a good laugh at the end. Yes Marjorie I
remember the Argyll Strathspey at the Argyle weekend in Virginia a few years
ago. You, Bob Blackie, and myself in one set and we got 1 out of the 8
tournees correct. It is a memory I will cherrish! The cheer that went up on
the correct one rocked the hall!

But because my favourite is someone elses 'sit out dance' and vice
versa......all these dances will continue to be done. Viva la
differance!!!!

Elaine (still in Hawaii) It's a tough job, but sombody has to do it!

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Message 22509 · Doug Mills · 11 Sep 2000 02:08:17 · Top

This is a brave call Dianna, The Braes of Breadalbane is one of the best
Starthspey tunes written, whereas The Garry Strathspey is little more than a
slowed down Polka.

It's true that there are some pretty diabolical recordings of the BoB, but if
you can get hold of the "Preliminary Certificate" recording from a few years
back, it has Robert McKay playing this beautifully.

The Braes also gives you an oppourtunity to show off your technique and
phrasing, whereas the Garry shows how many people can count to 4 when doing half
GC's.

I was pleased to see someone else dislikes the Wind on Loch Fyne, now that's
boring semi strathspey music if ever I heard it. Boring dance too, thank
goodness it's all over in 3 minutes.

Cheers

Doug Mills
Christchurch, New Zealand

Dianna Shipman wrote:

> Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:
>
> Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10 bars
> (plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)
>
> Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an English
> dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English dance
> I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even pace
> without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)
>
> Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music that
> sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has strange
> timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of bars one
> time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to fit the
> music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music or
> some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may feel a
> sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits but to
> me they're just not fun.
>
> Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad dash to
> 3rd place and go again)
>
> Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's due to
> the lack of horses:- )
>
> and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs when my
> feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).
>
> I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is having
> an effect.
>
> Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
> Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
> cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
> strokes for different folks".
>
> Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the first
> dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is often
> left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy being
> 40 bars and with a circle.
>
> But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there are
> plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16 plus
> dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can take a
> trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my list of
> dances I don't like :-)
>
> Dianna
>
> Dianna L. Shipman
> diannashipman@worldnet.att.net

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Message 22511 · adriana linden · 11 Sep 2000 02:27:24 · Top

My votes for dances to avoid are:
The Irish Rover
Seton's Ceilidh Band
Ian Powrie's Farewell to Auchterarder
... all of these because of the music

Petronella
Eightsome Reel
Strip the Willow
... all of these because of the unexciting repetition coupled
with
with high energy expenditure

I enjoy using dances such as the Garry Strathspey for dems, then I feel
that in these situations, I can use music that I like for the dance --
change the music from that Jig Time Polka, and the dance is great!

Adriana Linden
Montreal, QC Canada

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere!
http://mail.yahoo.com/

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Message 22515 · James R. Ferguson · 11 Sep 2000 03:12:20 · Top

A triple comment here...........

As someone who occasionally has back problems, I avoid strathspeys with
circles in them at those times. The circles are almost guaranteed to send me
to the chiropractor the next day.

As to the tournee, just about the time someone teaches or reviews it at a
workshop, and I think I've finally gotten it straight, I never see it again
at a dance for at least a year. Needless to say, by then, I've forgotten it
all over again.

Finally, I'd have to have one foot in a cast to sit out Mairi's Wedding or
Montgomerie's Rant, whereas a really, really slow strathspey, especially at
the end of a dance might find me watching from the side.

Marjorie McLaughlin wrote:

> Oh, too good an opportunity to pass up! Here are mine:
>
> Miss Gibson's Strathspey (only because of the tunes usually played)
> The Garry Strathspey (ditto)
> The White Heather Jig (oh dear, I appears that Mr. Cosh and I have
> different musical tastes)
>
> There's also my previously acknowledged prediliction for avoiding dances
> with the Tournee due to my inability to dance the figure without an
> excessive amount of mental effort and habit of dissolving into
> hysterical laughter as I try my best to get it right. Not among my
> finest social moments.
>
> Marjorie McLaughlin
> San Diego, CA
>
> Alan Paterson wrote:
> >
> > The recent long-winded exchange on another subject (No, I will not
> > repeat the name :-) has prompted me to make the following suggestion:
> >
> > Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
> > is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
> > especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
> > programmes.
> >
> > In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
> >
> > Waverley
> > M****'s W*****g
> >
> > And, from others in my own group, I can add
> >
> > Strip the Willow
> > Eightsome Reel
> >
> > Anyone else willing to confess?
> >
> > Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
> > reading this :-}
> >
> > As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
> > tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
> > you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
> > "Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!
> >
> > Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)
> >
> > --
> > Alan Paterson
> > Berne, Switzerland
> > mailto:alan@paterson.ch

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Message 22516 · James R. Ferguson · 11 Sep 2000 03:15:29 · Top

Sorry, I should have signed "Donna" to that last posting so as not to imply that
was my husband's opinion.
Donna

Jim and Donna Ferguson wrote:

> A triple comment here...........
>
> As someone who occasionally has back problems, I avoid strathspeys with
> circles in them at those times. The circles are almost guaranteed to send me
> to the chiropractor the next day.
>
> As to the tournee, just about the time someone teaches or reviews it at a
> workshop, and I think I've finally gotten it straight, I never see it again
> at a dance for at least a year. Needless to say, by then, I've forgotten it
> all over again.
>
> Finally, I'd have to have one foot in a cast to sit out Mairi's Wedding or
> Montgomerie's Rant, whereas a really, really slow strathspey, especially at
> the end of a dance might find me watching from the side.
>
> Marjorie McLaughlin wrote:
>
> > Oh, too good an opportunity to pass up! Here are mine:
> >
> > Miss Gibson's Strathspey (only because of the tunes usually played)
> > The Garry Strathspey (ditto)
> > The White Heather Jig (oh dear, I appears that Mr. Cosh and I have
> > different musical tastes)
> >
> > There's also my previously acknowledged prediliction for avoiding dances
> > with the Tournee due to my inability to dance the figure without an
> > excessive amount of mental effort and habit of dissolving into
> > hysterical laughter as I try my best to get it right. Not among my
> > finest social moments.
> >
> > Marjorie McLaughlin
> > San Diego, CA
> >
> > Alan Paterson wrote:
> > >
> > > The recent long-winded exchange on another subject (No, I will not
> > > repeat the name :-) has prompted me to make the following suggestion:
> > >
> > > Let's hear about those special dances for which your personal reaction
> > > is "Time for a visit to the bar, toilets, quick smoke, ...". I am
> > > especially thinking of those dances which are perennials on many dance
> > > programmes.
> > >
> > > In for a penny, in for a pound. I nominate, from my personal feelings:
> > >
> > > Waverley
> > > M****'s W*****g
> > >
> > > And, from others in my own group, I can add
> > >
> > > Strip the Willow
> > > Eightsome Reel
> > >
> > > Anyone else willing to confess?
> > >
> > > Please leave out dances recently devised. After all, the deviser may be
> > > reading this :-}
> > >
> > > As a follow on, perhaps we could have a finished list which one could
> > > tick off applicaple dances, apply some transformation formula (Anselm,
> > > you could create this, I'm sure) and out would come one's own personal
> > > "Fuddyduddy Index". Wow!
> > >
> > > Alan (being neither 100% serious nor 100% joking)
> > >
> > > --
> > > Alan Paterson
> > > Berne, Switzerland
> > > mailto:alan@paterson.ch

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22520 · Dianna Shipman · 11 Sep 2000 04:08:18 · Top

Doug
I guess this is still under the category of we all have different tastes -
to me Garry Strathspey sounds upbeat and fun and all the recordings I've
heard of Braes of B sound like a slowed down death march. I have no
interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find these
take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
(everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing that
they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea :-)
Happy dancing,
Dianna

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Mills" <radagast@cyberxpress.co.nz>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> This is a brave call Dianna, The Braes of Breadalbane is one of the best
> Starthspey tunes written, whereas The Garry Strathspey is little more than
a
> slowed down Polka.
>
> It's true that there are some pretty diabolical recordings of the BoB, but
if
> you can get hold of the "Preliminary Certificate" recording from a few
years
> back, it has Robert McKay playing this beautifully.
>
> The Braes also gives you an oppourtunity to show off your technique and
> phrasing, whereas the Garry shows how many people can count to 4 when
doing half
> GC's.
>
> I was pleased to see someone else dislikes the Wind on Loch Fyne, now
that's
> boring semi strathspey music if ever I heard it. Boring dance too, thank
> goodness it's all over in 3 minutes.
>
> Cheers
>
> Doug Mills
> Christchurch, New Zealand
>
>
>
> Dianna Shipman wrote:
>
> > Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:
> >
> > Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10
bars
> > (plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)
> >
> > Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an
English
> > dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English
dance
> > I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even pace
> > without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)
> >
> > Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music that
> > sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has strange
> > timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of bars
one
> > time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to fit
the
> > music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music
or
> > some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may
feel a
> > sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits
but to
> > me they're just not fun.
> >
> > Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad
dash to
> > 3rd place and go again)
> >
> > Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's due
to
> > the lack of horses:- )
> >
> > and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs when
my
> > feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).
> >
> > I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is
having
> > an effect.
> >
> > Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
> > Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
> > cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
> > strokes for different folks".
> >
> > Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the
first
> > dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is
often
> > left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy
being
> > 40 bars and with a circle.
> >
> > But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there
are
> > plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16 plus
> > dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can
take a
> > trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my list
of
> > dances I don't like :-)
> >
> > Dianna
> >
> > Dianna L. Shipman
> > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
>
>
>

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Message 22531 · Elainerb · 11 Sep 2000 06:29:40 · Top

In a message dated 9/10/00 8:09:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net writes:

<< I have no
interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find these
take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
(everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing that
they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea :-)
Happy dancing, >>

I am sorry to hear that! Dancing with good technique and phrasing is NOT
showing off. By dancing with good technique and phrasing you are being
considerate of your partner and the rest of the set. You are where you need
to be, and are responsible for your own dancing. If you have good technique
there is no straining. If you have good phrasing the dance just happens and
dancing like that always brings a huge smile to my face. By the way I think
BoB is one of the best dances written with one of the best tunes.

Elaine

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22532 · Chris1Ronald · 11 Sep 2000 07:16:00 · Top

In a message dated 09/10/2000 1:03:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
tpierce@terrabase.com writes:

>you can grow old get married and have kids during that dance.

EXCUSE ME, I am married and have kids, and certainly have not grown old! ;-)

> Unlike others though these dances mentioned before will certainly get me
> onto the floor, and for encores too -
> Waverley
> Mairi's Wedding
> Strip the Willow
> Eightsome Reel
> Montgomeries Rant
> White Heather Jig

As some others have said, these are high energy dances, and though too many
of them may spoil a programme, I too cannot resist dancing them.

I might add that I get equal enjoyment from a simple down the middle and up
in strathspey time done with a partner with whom I am in sync.

Chris


Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22580 · ron.mackey · 12 Sep 2000 02:20:05 · Top


> Unlike others though these dances mentioned before will certainly get me
> onto the floor, and for encores too -
> Waverley
> Mairi's Wedding
> Strip the Willow
> Eightsome Reel
> Montgomeries Rant
> White Heather Jig
>
> As some others have said, these are high energy dances, and though too many
> of them may spoil a programme, I too cannot resist dancing them.
>
> I might add that I get equal enjoyment from a simple down the middle and up
> in strathspey time done with a partner with whom I am in sync.
>
> Chris
>
I'm puzzled, Chris

Are there many who consider Monties' a high energy dance?
Cheers, Ron :)

< 0 Ron Mackey,(Purveyor of Pat's Party Pieces)
'O> Mottingham,
/#\ London. UK.
l>
Ron.Mackey@btinternet.com

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22579 · ron.mackey · 12 Sep 2000 02:20:03 · Top

. I do understand that other people get great
> satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea :-)
> Happy dancing, >>
>
> I am sorry to hear that! Dancing with good technique and phrasing is NOT
> showing off. By dancing with good technique and phrasing you are being
> considerate of your partner and the rest of the set. You are where you need
> to be, and are responsible for your own dancing. If you have good technique
> there is no straining. If you have good phrasing the dance just happens and
> dancing like that always brings a huge smile to my face. By the way I think
> BoB is one of the best dances written with one of the best tunes.
>
> Elaine

Elaine,
Yes.. provided it is done at the old speed and not as a pastoral !
:)

Cheers, Ron :)

< 0 Ron Mackey,(Purveyor of Pat's Party Pieces)
'O> Mottingham,
/#\ London. UK.
l>
Ron.Mackey@btinternet.com

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22533 · Patricia Ruggiero · 11 Sep 2000 07:24:46 · Top

Dianna wrote:

"I have no interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I
find these
take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
(everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing that
they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea
:-)"

At an SCD workshop I attended about two years ago, one outstanding teacher
summed up the point of all workshops and classes with the simple phrase:
"Enjoyment is enhanced by mastery of basic technique."

(This phrase has applications far beyond SCD.)

When technique is mastered, its execution is effortless.
And the resulting dancing is sublime.

Being the best we can be is not showing off.

Pat

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Mills" <radagast@cyberxpress.co.nz>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> This is a brave call Dianna, The Braes of Breadalbane is one of the best
> Starthspey tunes written, whereas The Garry Strathspey is little more than
a
> slowed down Polka.
>
> It's true that there are some pretty diabolical recordings of the BoB, but
if
> you can get hold of the "Preliminary Certificate" recording from a few
years
> back, it has Robert McKay playing this beautifully.
>
> The Braes also gives you an oppourtunity to show off your technique and
> phrasing, whereas the Garry shows how many people can count to 4 when
doing half
> GC's.
>
> I was pleased to see someone else dislikes the Wind on Loch Fyne, now
that's
> boring semi strathspey music if ever I heard it. Boring dance too, thank
> goodness it's all over in 3 minutes.
>
> Cheers
>
> Doug Mills
> Christchurch, New Zealand
>
>
>
> Dianna Shipman wrote:
>
> > Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:
> >
> > Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10
bars
> > (plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)
> >
> > Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an
English
> > dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English
dance
> > I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even pace
> > without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)
> >
> > Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music that
> > sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has strange
> > timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of bars
one
> > time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to fit
the
> > music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music
or
> > some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may
feel a
> > sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits
but to
> > me they're just not fun.
> >
> > Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad
dash to
> > 3rd place and go again)
> >
> > Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's due
to
> > the lack of horses:- )
> >
> > and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs when
my
> > feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).
> >
> > I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is
having
> > an effect.
> >
> > Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
> > Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
> > cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
> > strokes for different folks".
> >
> > Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the
first
> > dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is
often
> > left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy
being
> > 40 bars and with a circle.
> >
> > But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there
are
> > plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16 plus
> > dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can
take a
> > trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my list
of
> > dances I don't like :-)
> >
> > Dianna
> >
> > Dianna L. Shipman
> > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
>
>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22534 · Dianna Shipman · 11 Sep 2000 07:32:55 · Top

To me "dancing with good technique and phrasing" and "showing off technique
and phrasing" are not the same thing. "Dancing with good technique and
phrasing" is part of the dance. The "showing off" part to me implies that
you're trying to impress others who don't dance as well. I've been to balls
that have included one or more dances where out of a room of 100 plus people
only 2 sets get up for a dance so they can "show off"; these are usually
dances that require a lot of technique and phrasing to make them work.

Personally I don't find dances that require a lot of "phrasing" to make them
work much fun. When I dance a dance that requires a lot of "phrasing" it
doesn't FEEL like it flows well. The recent discussion shows that we all
have different tastes in music and dances. It would be a very dull world if
we all liked all the same things and only those things. :-)

Dianna

> In a message dated 9/10/00 8:09:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> diannashipman@worldnet.att.net writes:
>
> << I have no
> interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find these
> take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
> (everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing
that
> they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
> satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea
:-)
> Happy dancing, >>
>
> I am sorry to hear that! Dancing with good technique and phrasing is NOT
> showing off. By dancing with good technique and phrasing you are being
> considerate of your partner and the rest of the set. You are where you
need
> to be, and are responsible for your own dancing. If you have good
technique
> there is no straining. If you have good phrasing the dance just happens
and
> dancing like that always brings a huge smile to my face. By the way I
think
> BoB is one of the best dances written with one of the best tunes.
>
> Elaine
>
> --
> Elainerb@aol.com
>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22535 · James R. Ferguson · 11 Sep 2000 07:42:22 · Top

Dianna,
But, don't you need good phrasing in even simple dances? Good phrasing in
figures like rights and lefts, for example, gets you where you're supposed to be
when you're supposed to be there (so you're not arriving before everyone else,
waiting for someone to give you a hand), or casting off into second place
arriving just in time for everyone to set together, etc. I guess I think of
phrasing as just part of each dance. Doing that well increases my enjoyment of
the dance, and my interaction with the rest of the set.
Donna

Dianna Shipman wrote:

> To me "dancing with good technique and phrasing" and "showing off technique
> and phrasing" are not the same thing. "Dancing with good technique and
> phrasing" is part of the dance. The "showing off" part to me implies that
> you're trying to impress others who don't dance as well. I've been to balls
> that have included one or more dances where out of a room of 100 plus people
> only 2 sets get up for a dance so they can "show off"; these are usually
> dances that require a lot of technique and phrasing to make them work.
>
> Personally I don't find dances that require a lot of "phrasing" to make them
> work much fun. When I dance a dance that requires a lot of "phrasing" it
> doesn't FEEL like it flows well. The recent discussion shows that we all
> have different tastes in music and dances. It would be a very dull world if
> we all liked all the same things and only those things. :-)
>
> Dianna
>
> > In a message dated 9/10/00 8:09:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net writes:
> >
> > << I have no
> > interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find these
> > take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
> > (everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing
> that
> > they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
> > satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea
> :-)
> > Happy dancing, >>
> >
> > I am sorry to hear that! Dancing with good technique and phrasing is NOT
> > showing off. By dancing with good technique and phrasing you are being
> > considerate of your partner and the rest of the set. You are where you
> need
> > to be, and are responsible for your own dancing. If you have good
> technique
> > there is no straining. If you have good phrasing the dance just happens
> and
> > dancing like that always brings a huge smile to my face. By the way I
> think
> > BoB is one of the best dances written with one of the best tunes.
> >
> > Elaine
> >
> > --
> > Elainerb@aol.com
> >
> >

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22536 · Marjorie McLaughlin · 11 Sep 2000 07:46:18 · Top

Dianna Shipman wrote:

> Personally I don't find dances that require a lot of "phrasing" to make them
> work much fun.

ALL dances require phrasing.

Marjorie McLaughin
San Diego, CA

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22537 · Dianna Shipman · 11 Sep 2000 07:53:53 · Top

I don't disagree about mastering basic technique. I just don't find dances
that require a lot of "phrasing" as much fun. I don't know that we're
really disagreeing since I don't know exactly what each of us has in mind
with the concept of "showing off." It seems to me that there are very few
dances that are popular that require a lot of phrasing.

Dianna

>
> At an SCD workshop I attended about two years ago, one outstanding teacher
> summed up the point of all workshops and classes with the simple phrase:
> "Enjoyment is enhanced by mastery of basic technique."
>
> (This phrase has applications far beyond SCD.)
>
> When technique is mastered, its execution is effortless.
> And the resulting dancing is sublime.
>
> Being the best we can be is not showing off.
>
>
> Pat
>
>
> Dianna L. Shipman
> diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
> PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
> Houston, TX 77019-4946
> Scottish Country Dancing and More
> web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
> phone: 713-522-1212
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Doug Mills" <radagast@cyberxpress.co.nz>
> To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:10 PM
> Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)
>
>
> > This is a brave call Dianna, The Braes of Breadalbane is one of the best
> > Starthspey tunes written, whereas The Garry Strathspey is little more
than
> a
> > slowed down Polka.
> >
> > It's true that there are some pretty diabolical recordings of the BoB,
but
> if
> > you can get hold of the "Preliminary Certificate" recording from a few
> years
> > back, it has Robert McKay playing this beautifully.
> >
> > The Braes also gives you an oppourtunity to show off your technique and
> > phrasing, whereas the Garry shows how many people can count to 4 when
> doing half
> > GC's.
> >
> > I was pleased to see someone else dislikes the Wind on Loch Fyne, now
> that's
> > boring semi strathspey music if ever I heard it. Boring dance too,
thank
> > goodness it's all over in 3 minutes.
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Doug Mills
> > Christchurch, New Zealand
> >
> >
> >
> > Dianna Shipman wrote:
> >
> > > Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:
> > >
> > > Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10
> bars
> > > (plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)
> > >
> > > Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an
> English
> > > dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English
> dance
> > > I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even
pace
> > > without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)
> > >
> > > Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music
that
> > > sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has
strange
> > > timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of
bars
> one
> > > time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to
fit
> the
> > > music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music
> or
> > > some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may
> feel a
> > > sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits
> but to
> > > me they're just not fun.
> > >
> > > Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad
> dash to
> > > 3rd place and go again)
> > >
> > > Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's
due
> to
> > > the lack of horses:- )
> > >
> > > and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs
when
> my
> > > feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).
> > >
> > > I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is
> having
> > > an effect.
> > >
> > > Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
> > > Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
> > > cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
> > > strokes for different folks".
> > >
> > > Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the
> first
> > > dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is
> often
> > > left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy
> being
> > > 40 bars and with a circle.
> > >
> > > But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there
> are
> > > plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16
plus
> > > dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can
> take a
> > > trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my
list
> of
> > > dances I don't like :-)
> > >
> > > Dianna
> > >
> > > Dianna L. Shipman
> > > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22538 · Dianna Shipman · 11 Sep 2000 07:54:27 · Top

I agree about timing; however, to give an example, usually rights and lefts
is done in 8 bars. What I'm referring to is dances that require a lot of
phrasing in the sense of being "non-standard" - rights and lefts in 10 bars
or 4 bars to me require more "phrasing" and these are the kinds I don't find
as much fun. I can't think of a good word to describe the sorts of
non-standard pieces of a dance that would naturally feel awkward and that
require extra effort to make them "work."

Dianna

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim and Donna Ferguson" <jfergie@jadeinc.com>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 10:38 PM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> Dianna,
> But, don't you need good phrasing in even simple dances? Good phrasing in
> figures like rights and lefts, for example, gets you where you're supposed
to be
> when you're supposed to be there (so you're not arriving before everyone
else,
> waiting for someone to give you a hand), or casting off into second place
> arriving just in time for everyone to set together, etc. I guess I think
of
> phrasing as just part of each dance. Doing that well increases my
enjoyment of
> the dance, and my interaction with the rest of the set.
> Donna
>
> Dianna Shipman wrote:
>
> > To me "dancing with good technique and phrasing" and "showing off
technique
> > and phrasing" are not the same thing. "Dancing with good technique and
> > phrasing" is part of the dance. The "showing off" part to me implies
that
> > you're trying to impress others who don't dance as well. I've been to
balls
> > that have included one or more dances where out of a room of 100 plus
people
> > only 2 sets get up for a dance so they can "show off"; these are
usually
> > dances that require a lot of technique and phrasing to make them work.
> >
> > Personally I don't find dances that require a lot of "phrasing" to make
them
> > work much fun. When I dance a dance that requires a lot of "phrasing"
it
> > doesn't FEEL like it flows well. The recent discussion shows that we
all
> > have different tastes in music and dances. It would be a very dull
world if
> > we all liked all the same things and only those things. :-)
> >
> > Dianna
> >
> > > In a message dated 9/10/00 8:09:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> > > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net writes:
> > >
> > > << I have no
> > > interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find
these
> > > take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the
set
> > > (everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and
phrasing
> > that
> > > they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
> > > satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of
tea
> > :-)
> > > Happy dancing, >>
> > >
> > > I am sorry to hear that! Dancing with good technique and phrasing is
NOT
> > > showing off. By dancing with good technique and phrasing you are
being
> > > considerate of your partner and the rest of the set. You are where
you
> > need
> > > to be, and are responsible for your own dancing. If you have good
> > technique
> > > there is no straining. If you have good phrasing the dance just
happens
> > and
> > > dancing like that always brings a huge smile to my face. By the way
I
> > think
> > > BoB is one of the best dances written with one of the best tunes.
> > >
> > > Elaine
> > >
> > > --
> > > Elainerb@aol.com
> > >
> > >
>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22539 · Dianna Shipman · 11 Sep 2000 07:55:30 · Top

But some require more "phrasing" than others.

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marjorie McLaughlin" <marjoriem@home.com>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 10:44 PM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> Dianna Shipman wrote:
>
> > Personally I don't find dances that require a lot of "phrasing" to make
them
> > work much fun.
>
>
> ALL dances require phrasing.
>
>
> Marjorie McLaughin
> San Diego, CA
>
> --
> Marjorie McLaughlin <marjoriem@home.com>
>

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22542 · Oberdan Otto · 11 Sep 2000 09:03:22 · Top

>I don't disagree about mastering basic technique. I just don't find dances
>that require a lot of "phrasing" as much fun.

Perhaps what Dianna is referring to is dances having what I call
"critical phrasing"--all dancers must be in the right place at the
right time for the figure to work. For sure, such figures are
stressful--all the dancers know they have to do it a certain way and
that everyone is depending on them; but there is a lot of
satisfaction derived when everyone gets it right--and a lot of
hilarity generated when they don't! :))

I suspect there is a semantic disconnect operative here (i.e. the
words are getting in the way). I confess, I don't understand what "a
lot of phrasing" is supposed to mean. To me, you either phrase well
or you do not--you don't phrase "a lot". Also, I don't understand
what phrasing well has to do with showing off. These phrases clearly
mean something specific and important to you. But, once again I am
confused. (That seems to be happening a lot lately...hmmm...)

Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22543 · James R. Ferguson · 11 Sep 2000 09:37:37 · Top

Yep, she is right! My opinion is that I like them all and the only reason I sit out
a dance is if my feet and legs hurt so bad they just won't get me to the floor.

Jim

Jim and Donna Ferguson wrote:

> Sorry, I should have signed "Donna" to that last posting so as not to imply that
> was my husband's opinion.
> Donna
>
> Jim and Donna Ferguson wrote:
>
> > A triple comment here...........
> >
> > As someone who occasionally has back problems, I avoid strathspeys with
> > circles in them at those times. The circles are almost guaranteed to send me
> > to the chiropractor the next day.
> >
> > As to the tournee, just about the time someone teaches or reviews it at a
> > workshop, and I think I've finally gotten it straight, I never see it again
> > at a dance for at least a year. Needless to say, by then, I've forgotten it
> > all over again.
> >
> > Finally, I'd have to have one foot in a cast to sit out Mairi's Wedding or
> > Montgomerie's Rant, whereas a really, really slow strathspey, especially at
> > the end of a dance might find me watching from the side.
> >
> >

Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Message 22587 · Gerry Gray · 12 Sep 2000 05:44:55 · Top

Dianna Shipman recently wrote that she finds the Garry Strathspey "upbeat
and fun". That is certainly true of the recording of Garry Strathspey by
Jimmy Blair and his Jigtime Band. Blair is the composer of the tune Jigtime
Polka, used for Garry Strathspey.

- Gerry

Gerry Gray
18 Mutch Drive #10
Stratford, PE C1A 9K6
(902) 569-5633
gerry.gray@pei.sympatico.ca

-----Original Message-----
From: Dianna Shipman [mailto:diannashipman@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: September 10, 2000 8:42 PM
To: strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

Doug
I guess this is still under the category of we all have different tastes -
to me Garry Strathspey sounds upbeat and fun and all the recordings I've
heard of Braes of B sound like a slowed down death march. I have no
interest at all in showing off technique and phrasing since I find these
take away from enjoying dancing with my partner and the rest of the set
(everyone is straining so much to remember their technique and phrasing that
they don't even smile). I do understand that other people get great
satisfaction out of BofB and showing off but it's just not my cup of tea :-)
Happy dancing,
Dianna

Dianna L. Shipman
diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
PMB 134, 1436 W. Gray
Houston, TX 77019-4946
Scottish Country Dancing and More
web page: http://home.att.net/~diannashipman
phone: 713-522-1212
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Mills" <radagast@cyberxpress.co.nz>
To: <strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de>
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: Top Sit-out List (or Fuddyduddy index)

> This is a brave call Dianna, The Braes of Breadalbane is one of the best
> Starthspey tunes written, whereas The Garry Strathspey is little more than
a
> slowed down Polka.
>
> It's true that there are some pretty diabolical recordings of the BoB, but
if
> you can get hold of the "Preliminary Certificate" recording from a few
years
> back, it has Robert McKay playing this beautifully.
>
> The Braes also gives you an oppourtunity to show off your technique and
> phrasing, whereas the Garry shows how many people can count to 4 when
doing half
> GC's.
>
> I was pleased to see someone else dislikes the Wind on Loch Fyne, now
that's
> boring semi strathspey music if ever I heard it. Boring dance too, thank
> goodness it's all over in 3 minutes.
>
> Cheers
>
> Doug Mills
> Christchurch, New Zealand
>
>
>
> Dianna Shipman wrote:
>
> > Dances that I am currently inclined to avoid when possible at a ball:
> >
> > Wee Cooper of Fife - can't enjoy because constantly trying to count 10
bars
> > (plus I don't like the lyrics to the song)
> >
> > Bob O'Dowally (awkward, boring, and I suspect it was originally an
English
> > dance that somehow got accidentally labelled Scottish - as an English
dance
> > I think it would be quite nice since you could dance it at an even pace
> > without some turns being two bars and some four etc.)
> >
> > Braes of Braedalbane ( I think that's the one - that has the music that
> > sounds like a death march and makes me think of funerals and has strange
> > timing - any dance where the same figure is done with one number of bars
one
> > time and another number of bars later in the dance feel contrived to fit
the
> > music and don't flow as well - the exceptions usually have great music
or
> > some other part that's great fun to escape this flaw) Some folks may
feel a
> > sense of accomplishment in mastering dances with lots of awkward bits
but to
> > me they're just not fun.
> >
> > Wild Geese (the timing is awkward when you're trying to make the mad
dash to
> > 3rd place and go again)
> >
> > Machine without Horses (the dance seems to go nowhere - maybe that's due
to
> > the lack of horses:- )
> >
> > and St. Andrews' Fair (again it seems to show up later in programs when
my
> > feet just can't take that much pas de bas and circling).
> >
> > I used to enjoy Wild Geese and St. Andrews' Fair OK so maybe age is
having
> > an effect.
> >
> > Among my favorites are Waverley, Miss Gibson's Strathspey and Garry
> > Strathspey - I love the music; and White Heather Jig. brings to mind
> > cliches like "one man's trash is another man's treasure" - "different
> > strokes for different folks".
> >
> > Sometimes it's the placement of a dance on a program - I dislike the
first
> > dance having a 6 hands round circle or a pousette. Mairi's Wedding is
often
> > left too late in the evening - it's a dance that takes a lot of energy
being
> > 40 bars and with a circle.
> >
> > But with the total number of published dances approaching 10,000 there
are
> > plenty of dances for everyone's taste and since most balls have 16 plus
> > dances it's good to have one or two you don't mind missing so you can
take a
> > trip to the "loo" and my list of favorites is much longer than my list
of
> > dances I don't like :-)
> >
> > Dianna
> >
> > Dianna L. Shipman
> > diannashipman@worldnet.att.net
>
>
>

Learning Waltz

Message 22523 · Oberdan Otto · 11 Sep 2000 04:37:35 · Top

> Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or so
> have learned to waltz?????
>
>---------How about a dance workshop ????????
>
>Elaine

Well, I am just outside of "under the age of 50 or so", but I am
learning more about Waltz every week at the Round Dance classes I go
to. Like SCD, Round Dancing is a subculture that you can find in many
places (including US, Canada, Europe and Japan) once you get
connected to it. There is also an "Old Time Dance" subculture, which
is cosmetically similar to Round Dance, but with different roots and
different emphasis. I don't know much about it, because it is not
available in my locale. However, Ruth and Alex Jappy are part of that
subculture and might be able to guide you to centers in your locale.
Also Ballroom classes at the local Parks & Rec or even dance studios
(if money is no object). The curriculum in these learning outlets,
however, is not exclusive to Waltz--you must tolerate other fun stuff
like Foxtrot, Tango, Cha-cha, Rumba, Swing, Jive, Quickstep, Samba,
Salsa...and it is really hard to do without a regular partner.

Also, Waltzing, like SCD is not just something you can learn at a
single event like a workshop. "Okay, I went to a Waltzing class for 2
hours, so now I can Waltz." Right! Like any skill, it needs practice,
repetition and coaching. I recently did a 2.5-hour workshop on Waltz
for the local RSCDS Branch, and although we covered a lot of ground,
we only just scratched the surface. It was an "Introduction" to
Waltz, and I hope the people got a glimpse of the richness and depth
of Waltz.

Although Scottish Waltzes are part of the Scottish dancing culture,
they are not part of the RSCDS training. If you only want to dabble
at Waltz, there are probably a lot of RSCDS teachers that can teach
you enough to have some fun spinning around the floor. But if you
really want to learn how to Waltz, you should find a teacher who
really knows Ballroom dance.

Cheers, Oberdan.

184 Estaban Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010-1611 USA
Voice: (805) 389-0063, FAX: (805) 484-2775, email: ootto@ootto.com

Learning Waltz

Message 22527 · tlb · 11 Sep 2000 05:08:49 · Top

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Subject: Learning Waltz

> Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or so
> have learned to waltz?????
>
>---------How about a dance workshop ????????
>

Usually, two or three weeks before their wedding...

My husband and I joined the SCD dance community about 10 years ago. We =
were so caught up in it and wanted to do everything! Alas, Dave had not =
learned to waltz!

Fortunately, one of the branch SCD teachers, Sara Gratiot, is an =
excellent waltz teacher as well, so I contacted her to inquire about =
private lessons. Because of the driving distance, we decided to put on =
a mini-series featuring Scottish waltz and circle waltz classes.

I hand distributed flyers about the series to the local SCD classes, and =
left some at ballroom supply stores, bookshops, etc. =20

The classes were well attended by adults (of diverse ages), and they =
were great fun!

But the funny thing is, for YEARS afterwards I would get calls from =
complete strangers urgently inquiring about waltz classes, "Because =
we're getting married next month". (Some forgotten flyer stuck on a =
shop wall somewhere was to blame, I guess.)

Terry Barron
San Jose, CA

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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Learning Waltz</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>&gt;&nbsp; Where in the US would somebody under the age of 50 or=20
so<BR>&gt;&nbsp; have learned to waltz?????<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;---------How =
about a=20
dance workshop ????????<BR>&gt;<BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Usually, two or three weeks before their=20
wedding...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>My husband and I joined the SCD dance community =
about 10 years=20
ago.&nbsp; We were so caught up in it and wanted to do everything!&nbsp; =
Alas,=20
Dave had not learned to waltz!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Fortunately, one of the branch SCD teachers, Sara=20
Gratiot,&nbsp;is an excellent waltz teacher as well, so I contacted her =
to=20
inquire about private lessons.&nbsp; Because&nbsp;of the driving =
distance, we=20
decided to put on a mini-series featuring Scottish waltz and circle =
waltz=20
classes.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I hand distributed flyers about the series to the =
local SCD=20
classes, and left some at ballroom supply stores, bookshops, etc.&nbsp;=20
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>The classes&nbsp;</FONT><FONT size=3D2>were well =
attended by=20
adults (of diverse ages), and they were&nbsp;great fun!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>But the funny thing is, for YEARS afterwards I would =
get calls=20
from complete strangers urgently inquiring about waltz classes, "Because =
we're=20
getting married next month".&nbsp; (Some forgotten flyer stuck on a shop =
wall=20
somewhere was to blame, I guess.)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Terry Barron</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>San Jose, CA</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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