strathspey Archive: Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

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Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21539 · Chris Brent-Smith · 20 Jun 2000 15:29:32 · Top

To our Scottish Dancing friends around the world.
A few months ago, we put out on the Web details of a
new, amusing and informative book under the title of

" SCOTTISH REELS ARE FUN "

Edge Reels is a small Scottish Country Dance group
based near Stroud in the Cotswolds UK. To those of
you who did not see the original message, the book
covers basic Progressions and Formations, and then
instructions for thirty four of the many popular dances
we currently enjoy at Edge. It is lavishly illustrated
throughout with many full colour hilarious, but relevant
cartoons by our resident artist - it is worth having for
the cartoons alone !!

The book has now gone around the world, and the 'fun'
element has been greatly enjoyed, particularly the
cartoons. As well as being useful to dancers, it is
evidently proving to be a great gift for newcomers, and
for anyone interested in SCD. Many people have now
asked if we could produce Posters of the cartoons in
the book, so they could put them up at dances, and use
them for general SCD publicity. This we have done, and
sixteen full colour double laminated Posters are now
available in A3 size (16.6" x 11.7" - 420mm x 297mm)

If you have a moment, do look at our Website below,
where you can read about the Book and see all the Posters.

http://www.edgereels.care4free.net


Happy Dancing !!

Chris Brent-Smith <edgereels@care4free.net>

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21541 · Melbourne Briscoe · 20 Jun 2000 17:33:39 · Top

I guess this message will start me down the road to being an "old fogey,"
or at least a curmudgeon, only the latter of which I have ever aspired to,
but I don't find the posters referred to in the message below to be the way
I think about SCD, and not at all the way I would like to portray it to
newcomers. In fact, I find most of the posters somewhat irritating or even
offensive. They seem kind of like 19th century back-room "old boy" humor,
and I had hoped we had gotten beyond that.

I suppose some will take this message as a "flame" toward Mr/Mrs/Miss?
Brent-Smith or toward the Edge group, neither of which is intended.
Perhaps, at most, it is a flame toward the posters themselves and what they
represent.

Sorry to be so grumpy so early in the week, but I care a lot about SCD and
don't want to see it represented in this way.

- Mel Briscoe, Virginia, USA

At 12:32 PM 6/20/00 +0100, you wrote:
> To our Scottish Dancing friends around the world.
>A few months ago, we put out on the Web details of a
>new, amusing and informative book under the title of
>
> " SCOTTISH REELS ARE FUN "
>
>Edge Reels is a small Scottish Country Dance group
>based near Stroud in the Cotswolds UK. To those of
>you who did not see the original message, the book
>covers basic Progressions and Formations, and then
>instructions for thirty four of the many popular dances
>we currently enjoy at Edge. It is lavishly illustrated
>throughout with many full colour hilarious, but relevant
>cartoons by our resident artist - it is worth having for
>the cartoons alone !!
>
>The book has now gone around the world, and the 'fun'
>element has been greatly enjoyed, particularly the
>cartoons. As well as being useful to dancers, it is
>evidently proving to be a great gift for newcomers, and
>for anyone interested in SCD. Many people have now
>asked if we could produce Posters of the cartoons in
>the book, so they could put them up at dances, and use
>them for general SCD publicity. This we have done, and
>sixteen full colour double laminated Posters are now
>available in A3 size (16.6" x 11.7" - 420mm x 297mm)
>
>If you have a moment, do look at our Website below,
>where you can read about the Book and see all the Posters.
>
> http://www.edgereels.care4free.net
>
>
>Happy Dancing !!
>
>
>Chris Brent-Smith <edgereels@care4free.net>
>
>
>
>

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21543 · Anselm Lingnau · 20 Jun 2000 18:32:10 · Top

Melbourne Briscoe <Mel@Briscoe.com> writes:

> but I don't find the posters referred to in the message below to be the way
> I think about SCD, and not at all the way I would like to portray it to
> newcomers. In fact, I find most of the posters somewhat irritating or even
> offensive. [...]
> Perhaps, at most, it is a flame toward the posters themselves and what they
> represent.
>
> Sorry to be so grumpy so early in the week, but I care a lot about SCD and
> don't want to see it represented in this way.

I've had a look at the WWW site when it was new and I thought some of
the posters in question (not all) actually were quite funny. However I
can see that others would disagree with that. (Probably some would find
the unfunny-to-me posters utterly hilarious and vice-versa.)

Anyway I'd say that whether the pictures are irritating or offensive or
side-splittingly comical isn't going to make a big difference in the
grand scheme of things. What is really more important when it comes to
portraying SCD to newcomers is the attitude of the people that they have
to contend with -- teachers and fellow group-members and so on. If
newcomers are greeted with sincerity, openness and consideration I don't
think whatever is printed in a book or put up on a wall alone is going
to turn them off (other things may). And at the end of the day it's up
to you whether you put up the Edge Reels posters at your beginner's
class! If you think people won't enjoy them (and the British approach to
that may well be different from the American approach) then just leave
them where they are (in the privacy of your home or in Edge, as the case
may be).

The thing that concerns me more about this issue has to do with the
Strathspey list. Careful readers of the list will have noticed that the
Edge Reels poster announcement had been published for the first time on
24 May, about four weeks ago. Now I think we all agree that tasteful
announcements of new products (like books and CDs) that have to do with
SCD are a welcome and informative addition to the list traffic, and
actually the list's blurb says so. But what I personally would like to
see is people posting their full announcements just once instead of
every four weeks.

Of course I don't mean to insinuate that Chris plans to remind us of the
Edge Reels posters every month from now on. In fact it must be
emphasized that in Chris's case the original `announcement' was in reply
to Bruce Hamilton's asking for pictures that show `the joy of dancing',
so depending on your individual mind-set this was actually quite
topical; however it is understandable that Chris might like to have the
actual announcement in a more prominent place, i.e., its own message. I
suppose what I would have done in Chris's place was to post a reply to
Bruce's question saying something like `see the announcement that I've
just posted separately' and then put up the actual announcement under
its own subject line. From then on, if somebody asks for funny SCD
posters, a brief message saying, in effect, `We have some nice ones on
http://...' should get the point across without having to repeat the
whole announcement to the list. Or the full announcement could be sent
by private e-mail to the person who asked. In any event I think we can
assume that most of the readership have seen the full announcement by
now, and that it doesn't need to be repeated for the foreseeable future.
Just think what the list would be like, if, with so many creative minds
among the subscribers, everybody thought it helpful to remind everybody
else of their respective offerings once per month or so.

Curmudgeonly yours,
Anselm
--
Anselm Lingnau (Frankfurt, Germany), Strathspey SCD mailing list maintainer
strathspey-request@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de (`Subject: help' for info)
SCD stuff on WWW at http://www.tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de/strathspey/

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21587 · Murray Wilson · 22 Jun 2000 15:18:40 · Top

At 16:32 20/06/00 +0200, you wrote:
>Melbourne Briscoe <Mel@Briscoe.com> writes:
>
>> but I don't find the posters referred to in the message below to be the way
>> I think about SCD, and not at all the way I would like to portray it to
>> newcomers. In fact, I find most of the posters somewhat irritating or even
>> offensive. [...]
>> Perhaps, at most, it is a flame toward the posters themselves and what they
>> represent.
>>
>> Sorry to be so grumpy so early in the week, but I care a lot about SCD and
>> don't want to see it represented in this way.
>
>I've had a look at the WWW site when it was new and I thought some of
>the posters in question (not all) actually were quite funny. However I
>can see that others would disagree with that. (Probably some would find
>the unfunny-to-me posters utterly hilarious and vice-versa.)
>
>Anyway I'd say that whether the pictures are irritating or offensive or
>side-splittingly comical isn't going to make a big difference in the
>grand scheme of things. What is really more important when it comes to
>portraying SCD to newcomers is the attitude of the people that they have
>to contend with -- teachers and fellow group-members and so on. If
>newcomers are greeted with sincerity, openness and consideration I don't
>think whatever is printed in a book or put up on a wall alone is going
>to turn them off (other things may). And at the end of the day it's up
>to you whether you put up the Edge Reels posters at your beginner's
>class! If you think people won't enjoy them (and the British approach to
>that may well be different from the American approach) then just leave
>them where they are (in the privacy of your home or in Edge, as the case
>may be).
>
>The thing that concerns me more about this issue has to do with the
>Strathspey list. Careful readers of the list will have noticed that the
>Edge Reels poster announcement had been published for the first time on
>24 May, about four weeks ago. Now I think we all agree that tasteful
>announcements of new products (like books and CDs) that have to do with
>SCD are a welcome and informative addition to the list traffic, and
>actually the list's blurb says so. But what I personally would like to
>see is people posting their full announcements just once instead of
>every four weeks.
>
>Of course I don't mean to insinuate that Chris plans to remind us of the
>Edge Reels posters every month from now on. In fact it must be
>emphasized that in Chris's case the original `announcement' was in reply
>to Bruce Hamilton's asking for pictures that show `the joy of dancing',
>so depending on your individual mind-set this was actually quite
>topical; however it is understandable that Chris might like to have the
>actual announcement in a more prominent place, i.e., its own message. I
>suppose what I would have done in Chris's place was to post a reply to
>Bruce's question saying something like `see the announcement that I've
>just posted separately' and then put up the actual announcement under
>its own subject line. From then on, if somebody asks for funny SCD
>posters, a brief message saying, in effect, `We have some nice ones on
>http://...' should get the point across without having to repeat the
>whole announcement to the list. Or the full announcement could be sent
>by private e-mail to the person who asked. In any event I think we can
>assume that most of the readership have seen the full announcement by
>now, and that it doesn't need to be repeated for the foreseeable future.
>Just think what the list would be like, if, with so many creative minds
>among the subscribers, everybody thought it helpful to remind everybody
>else of their respective offerings once per month or so.
>
>Curmudgeonly yours,
>Anselm
>--
>Anselm Lingnau (Frankfurt, Germany), Strathspey SCD mailing list maintainer
>strathspey-request@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de (`Subject: help' for info)
>SCD stuff on WWW at http://www.tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.de/strathspey/
>
>
>
>

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21558 · Priscilla M. Burrage · 21 Jun 2000 17:28:44 · Top

On Tue, 20 Jun 2000, Melbourne Briscoe wrote:

> I guess this message will start me down the road to being an "old fogey,"
> or at least a curmudgeon, only the latter of which I have ever aspired to,
> but I don't find the posters referred to in the message below to be the way
> I think about SCD, and not at all the way I would like to portray it to
> newcomers. In fact, I find most of the posters somewhat irritating or even
> offensive. They seem kind of like 19th century back-room "old boy" humor,
> and I had hoped we had gotten beyond that.
>
> I suppose some will take this message as a "flame" toward Mr/Mrs/Miss?
> Brent-Smith or toward the Edge group, neither of which is intended.
> Perhaps, at most, it is a flame toward the posters themselves and what they
> represent.
>
> Sorry to be so grumpy so early in the week, but I care a lot about SCD and
> don't want to see it represented in this way.

To me, they showed the difference between British and American humor
(humour). To Americans, they are just not funny. And they would not
have been funny even before our current PC attitude. They are pre- World
War I humor to us.

But the Brits still seem to find them funny so we should practise our
PC tolerance.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Priscilla Burrage Vermont US
(pburrage@zoo.uvm.edu)

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21559 · Richard L. Walker · 21 Jun 2000 17:53:54 · Top

I thought almost all the cartoons were cute (I must be British). PC? Don't
even get me started.

"Richard L Walker"<rlwalker@granis.net>
Pensacola, FL USA 32504-7726

=====
To me, they showed the difference between British and American humor
(humour). To Americans, they are just not funny. And they would not
have been funny even before our current PC attitude. They are pre- World
War I humor to us.

But the Brits still seem to find them funny so we should practise our
PC tolerance.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Priscilla Burrage Vermont US
(pburrage@zoo.uvm.edu)

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21560 · Ian Brockbank · 21 Jun 2000 19:25:22 · Top

Richard Walker wrote:

> I thought almost all the cartoons were cute (I must be
> British). PC? Don't even get me started.

But why aren't the best cartoons (Auld Lang Syne and the front cover
from the book) available as posters?

Another thought in the PC/SCD image melting pot - the book is very
obviously in the reeling tradition rather than SCD (and I believe Edge
Reels, the group who published it, are a reeling group rather than an
SCD group) - and the cartoons fit into my image of reelers. (Maybe
that just means I have an outdated stereotype of reelers...)

Ian
--
Ian Brockbank, Indigo Active Vision Systems, The Edinburgh Technopole,
Bush Loan, Edinburgh EH26 0PJ Tel: 0131-475-7234 Fax: 0131-475-7201
work: ian@indigo-avs.com personal: Ian.Brockbank@bigfoot.com
web: ScottishDance@bigfoot.com http://www.scottishdance.net/
Feed the World http://www.hungersite.com/

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21572 · harvey · 22 Jun 2000 00:44:43 · Top

I too was disturbed by the impact that the cartoons would have on my
beginners. In particular, I have a very hard time convincing my SCD
students at Swarthmore College that they will have a good time
socializing with other members of the community (and they are almost
*all* older than the college students :> ).

If one of my young female students saw a poster that presented SCD as
an activity where old men stared at the chests of young women, for
example, I know I would have a very difficult time convincing her to
attend a social.

But even worse would be that my students might think that the SCD
community at large believes that a poster like that is somehow
humorous. This leads to the conclusion that behavior like this not
only occurs on the dance floor, but is considered funny.

from another piece of this thread:

> I have failed to see any significant influx of young dancers
> going to dances.

I you want to attract dancers of any age, you have to make them
comfortable. One of the things that makes the young women in my
classes *uncomfortable* is the (rare, thank goodness) leering and
staring male at a ball. It is one thing to have something like this
happen and have support from a community that clucks disapprovingly,
agrees that the behavior is a shame, and helps fend him off during
tea. It would be another thing entirely if we put up posters
suggesting it were funny.

Our branch probably has over twenty dancers under the age of thirty at
a given ball. If you are not getting results like this, please
consider that everything you do and say communicates a message, and
try and figure out what messages you are sending that might affect the
age of your attendees.

Terry

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21578 · Cecilia Stolzer Grote · 22 Jun 2000 09:53:06 · Top

Message text written by INTERNET:strathspey@tm.informatik.uni-frankfurt.d=
e
>But the Brits still seem to find them funny so we should practise our
PC tolerance.<

They also find Benny Hill funny!

Cecilia

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21579 · Peter Hastings · 22 Jun 2000 11:39:17 · Top

> They also find Benny Hill funny!

The reactions to this have tended to be couched in generalisations which
are, as we all know, false.

Some Brits find Benny Hill funny. So do some non-Brits.

Change Thread

Terry Harvey's point is a good one and far too seldom acknowledged in the
UK. There are groups (not many) who attract and retain young dancers and
there needs to be a wider understanding of what can be learned from the
way that they operate. I am perhaps fortunate to have spent most
of my dancing life in such groups. If that understanding is not developed
and acted on, Malcolm Brown's vigorous and athletic form of SCD (as per
the RSCDS) will surely die out. Since many of us are (excessively ?) fond
of this type of dancing that would be a pity. The Youth Committee of the
Society is currently canvassing young members of the RSCDS about their
views on dancing. Young dancers who dance the RSCDS form of SCD but are
not members of the Society probably need to be consulted also.

Peter Hastings
Royal Observatory
Edinburgh
:)

SCD (per the RSCDS) - whenever I can
ceilidh - seldom
reeling - not had the opportunity

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21588 · SallenNic · 22 Jun 2000 16:13:41 · Top

In a message dated 21/6/2000 9:45:21 pm, harvey@mail.eecis.udel.edu writes:

>But even worse would be that my students might think that the SCD
>community at large believes that a poster like that is somehow
>humorous. This leads to the conclusion that behavior like this not
>only occurs on the dance floor, but is considered funny.
Surely this is a case of "Autre pays. autre moeurs"?
Having lived in Scotland for over thirty years now, I am well aware that
certain things which would be considered amusing in southern England would
cause offence here - and that is just within this one small island. How much
greater, therefore, is the potential for differences on either side of the
Atlantic?
Nicolas B., LAnark, Scotland.

Illustrated SCD Book and Posters

Message 21589 · SallenNic · 22 Jun 2000 16:38:25 · Top

In a message dated 22/6/2000 6:53:49 am, dancingcouple@compuserve.com writes:

>They also find Benny Hill funny!
>
>
>
>Cecilia
Benny Hill was far from being popular in Britain for a number of years before
his death, and his television work was virtually unseen for a number of
years. We learned with great surprise after his death that he had been much
admired abroad.
Personally, I can find a small amount of his humour amusing, but I view
it as 'live cartoon', having little or no relation to life today. It is 'time
warp' humour.
Nicolas B., Lanark, Scotland.

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